Decarboxylization

[+Dizledot]

The exact science of decaboxylliztion is more of an art. I've never read a study done with a mass spectrometer to determine the optimum time or temperature. I've found it's less about following an exact time and temperature for all types of bud, trim or extracted oil/kief - than starting somewhere in the middle (where your resin won't be vaporized but it's still hot enough to decarboxylize) and adjusting from experience.

223F for 15 minutes for dry trim does a great job for me, as does stuffing my toaster oven full of fresh cut leaves and baking for an hour at 225F. I cook my brownies at 300F to 350F, with an oven thermometer to guarantee temperature. The higher the temperature the less time you want to bake to avoid damaging the THC. Its always better to under heat than over heat.

The 1 - 3 hours in the crock pot is for extraction mostly, the decarboxylization is a serendipitous side effect but again with the process you will need a thermometer to check the temp and I never let it get any higher than 260F - 275F.

If there are any more opinions please add them..... The more information on this subject the better. Medibles are selling like crazy right now and those of us who do cook appreciate sharing info ; )
Dizz

[imiubu]

The exact science of decaboxylliztion is more of an art. I've never read a study done with a mass spectrometer to determine the optimum time or temperature. I've found it's less about following an exact time and temperature for all types of bud, trim or extracted oil/kief - than starting somewhere in the middle (where your resin won't be vaporized but it's still hot enough to decarboxylize) and adjusting from experience.

 

223F for 15 minutes for dry trim does a great job for me, as does stuffing my toaster oven full of fresh cut leaves and baking for an hour at 225F. I cook my brownies at 300F to 350F, with an oven thermometer to guarantee temperature. The higher the temperature the less time you want to bake to avoid damaging the THC. Its always better to under heat than over heat.

 

The 1 - 3 hours in the crock pot is for extraction mostly, the decarboxylization is a serendipitous side effect but again with the process you will need a thermometer to check the temp and I never let it get any higher than 260F - 275F.

 

If there are any more opinions please add them..... The more information on this subject the better. Medibles are selling like crazy right now and those of us who do cook appreciate sharing info ; )

Dizz

Great bit of info... thanks!

[super12]

I have been researching and doing my own experiments with cooking. T.H.C boiling point is 355f to 390f. decarboxylize at around 220F. the internal temps of most baked goods almost never goes over 220 thats why when I make butter I keep it at a temp around 230 to ensure decarboxlization....I have had good luck cooking at high temps even 500+ for some items like my artisan breads. just opinion but I think as long as the internal temp of what ever you are making stays below say 300 there will be little thc loss. handmade croissants with 8 oz of cannabutter baked in 400f oven I made a mistake and ate a whole one way too strong knocked me out.

[peanutbutter]

Hey Dizz.

 

Great write up. I can't add any more to what you've wrote here.

 

thanks

 

pb

 

For those that don't get it:

 

The THC, and other cannabinoids, exist within the marijuana plant in a form that is not "active" within the human body.

 

Heating these compounds "activates" them.

[lene]

On baking temps; there has been some debate on ovens getting over the temp dialed while it cycles. What about convection ovens? Do they cycle the same way or is it still something to be concerned out. For example a carrot cake that calls for 350', should it be set for less for either a regular oven or convection oven. This one is a smaller one on the counter.

[HeartoFgreen]

What would happen if you infused liquid nitrogen into thc? I wanted to try and make THC ice cream flavors and then do the dripping method with the custard base to make the dip-n-dot's type of ice cream.

[2d]

On baking temps; there has been some debate on ovens getting over the temp dialed while it cycles. What about convection ovens? Do they cycle the same way or is it still something to be concerned out. For example a carrot cake that calls for 350', should it be set for less for either a regular oven or convection oven. This one is a smaller one on the counter.

Best use an oven thermometer, my convection oven shows a temp 25 degrees F. higher than the actual temp., it's designed that way to work with older recipies according to Jenn-Air. (Drives me nuts) I use an older Taylor timer/temp probe alarm and heat middle rack away from the element. Way back when it was done on the stove top using the "smell" test.

[Herb Cannabis]

I understood that once your cannabis has dried completely that it has been decaboxyllized. Thus you will not have to worry about over heating it. I read this on a forum not so long ago.

[Shredder]

I understood that once your cannabis has dried completely that it has been decaboxyllized. Thus you will not have to worry about over heating it. I read this on a forum not so long ago.

 

 

I believe your right, it isn't the heat that decarbolizing it's the dryness. I've read about folks using dehydrators for decarbing too. I have put some in a bowl on top my warm and very dry water heater, and that got the herb good and dry. When the ratio of water to oil in the resin glands is right, the cannabinoids are then activated, or made physco tropic. This can happen maybe faster with heat, but it's not totally nessasary. For normal decarbing I use an oven preheated to 275 for 5 minutes for fairly dry buds and slightly longer for less dry or larger buds. The thing I look for is that the plant material is crispy dry, and that is grinds to powder in the coffee grinder. If it's too wet the grinder gums up, and the plant material is clumpy..........shredder

[Cannalytics]

These studies have been done: http://michiganmedicalmarijuana.org/topic/35900-the-importance-of-decarboxylation-in-edible-making/page__p__344547__hl__edibles__fromsearch__1#entry344547

[Cannalytics]

I understood that once your cannabis has dried completely that it has been decaboxyllized. Thus you will not have to worry about over heating it. I read this on a forum not so long ago.

 

Incorrect. The average bud we test has a THC Max of 15.3%, comprised of 17.0% THCA and 0.4 % THC. The THCA value must be multiplied by 0.87 before adding to the THC value to obtain THC Max to account for the loss of carbon dioxide during decarboxylation (13% of the THCA molecule is carbon dioxide, 87% is THC).

[Cannalytics]

[cristinew]

so at 180 f for 18 hours what % of the oil is decarbox????? does anyone know

 

this done in an enclosed system so the flavonoids and terpenoids are some wnat not lost into the air,\\

 

but the main question is what temp how long

 

say 4 hours at 200f for 100 % active

 

or 10 hours at 180 1 hour at 300 ???

 

would be nice to know.. does any one know

Edited April 15, 2012 by cristinew

[cristinew]

Maximum conversion of THCA into THC has been reported to occur by heating for 15

minutes, at 300 degrees Fahrenheit, which results in a 70% conversion rate.

 

 

that was posted on the other thread, so most RSO people make is not up to par.

[Cannalytics]

Maximum conversion of THCA into THC has been reported to occur by heating for 15

minutes, at 300 degrees Fahrenheit, which results in a 70% conversion rate.

 

 

that was posted on the other thread, so most RSO people make is not up to par.

 

Most RSO is actually fully decarboxylated, although trim, hash, and BHO are not. The only RSO that isn't typically decarboxylated will be on the "runny" side which is a sign that not enough heat was applied to evaporate the solvent. In the study that I referenced, a 15 minute decarboxylation time was fixed, and a broad range of temperatures were applied. Other combinations of time and temperature may also work. We also encourage people to pre-heat their plant material or hash before mixing with any other ingredients because there are "matrix effects" which could also alter the time and temperature required for decarboxylation. If pre-activating, be sure that your oven AND pan are pre-heated or the material won't truly be at an internal temperature of 300F for 15 minutes.

[Restorium2]

Food dehydrators work excellent. Dry it for at least 4 hours. You really can't over dry it so go ahead and do it overnight.

[Cannalytics]

Food dehydrators work excellent. Dry it for at least 4 hours. You really can't over dry it so go ahead and do it overnight.

 

We've never tested anything that's been through the dehydrator. If this does work, it's because of the heat, not the dryness. Also, unless you have your material tested, there's no way to know if it's fully activated. It's also important to note that products will still be effective if not fully decarboxylated, you're just not maximizing the effects.

Edited April 15, 2012 by Cannalytics

[Restorium2]

We've never tested anything that's been through the dehydrator. If this does work, it's because of the heat, not the dryness.

Right. The dryness helps in other ways. The absence of H2O helps the process. You want it as dry as possible. So you are doing two good things at once.

[Champion Jack Dupree]

What would happen if you infused liquid nitrogen into thc? I wanted to try and make THC ice cream flavors and then do the dripping method with the custard base to make the dip-n-dot's type of ice cream.

Two scoops of carmel-licious please CJD

[cristinew]

i would be nice to see how long and what temps do the job,

 

glad i do not have to heat in the open air

[cristinew]

Cannabis: flavonoids and terpenoids - what do you know?

 

http://www.bluelight...p/t-180508.html

 

 

At 31°C (87°F) the less volatile terpenoids start to evaporate, lending the air even more pungent odors.

 

At 39°C (102°F ) virtually all of the terpenoids undergo evaporation fairly rapidly.

Edited April 15, 2012 by cristinew

[+Green Cross]

Hey Zach. Green Cross here with a question please. What if someone prepared a quart of alcohol-based tincture without first decarboxing the bud?

 

Scenario: a canning jar containing one ounce of trimmed bud that was never heated above room temp, one fifth of 151 rum, two months in the fridge and shaken daily. Can the tincture be heated post facto to decarbox it? Better to heat the sealed jar in a boiling bath, or to open the jar and heat it in a boiling bath? Pour the liquid into saucepan and heat it on a stove? Pour it into a pyrex pan and heat in an oven at 300? Other suggestions? Thanks in advance dude.

 

Most RSO is actually fully decarboxylated, although trim, hash, and BHO are not. The only RSO that isn't typically decarboxylated will be on the "runny" side which is a sign that not enough heat was applied to evaporate the solvent.

[Cannalytics]

Cannabis: flavonoids and terpenoids - what do you know?

 

Have you had Northern Labs measure the terpene content of your starting material and your final product? We can speculate all we want but there's just too many variables. Performing the science is the only way to confirm or reject a hypothesis.

 

Here are two tables that list the approximate boiling points of the terpenes:

 

http://chemeducator.org/sbibs/s0006001/spapers/610028ds.htm (see Table 3)

http://vapetemp.com/science/terpenoids

 

It appears than many of them boil around the 300degF we recommend for decarboxylation. However keep in mind that these compounds are not completely disappearing once these temperatures are hit. When you're boiling a pot of water on the stove it doesn't all disappear as soon as it hits 100degC. Since BHOs do not require heating and the solvent is often vacuum purged without heat, these types of extractions will retain the terpenes. If you want a terpene-rich RSO you could always infuse it with food-grade terpenes (which can be purchased through chemical suppliers) after decarboxylation.

[Cannalytics]

Hey Zach. Green Cross here with a question please. What if someone prepared a quart of alcohol-based tincture without first decarboxing the bud?

 

Scenario: a canning jar containing one ounce of trimmed bud that was never heated above room temp, one fifth of 151 rum, two months in the fridge and shaken daily. Can the tincture be heated post facto to decarbox it? Better to heat the sealed jar in a boiling bath, or to open the jar and heat it in a boiling bath? Pour the liquid into saucepan and heat it on a stove? Pour it into a pyrex pan and heat in an oven at 300? Other suggestions? Thanks in advance dude.

 

I'd say the safest thing to do would be to evaporate the alcohol with the lid off so you don't have to worry about building up too much pressure that may shatter the glass. Then heat the material for 300degF at 15 minutes (this time and temp only works if both the oven AND the decarboxylation surface are pre-heated; glass is an insulator so if you place the room-temperature jar into the oven, the glass will not immediately be 300degF, thus you won't truly be at 300degF for 15 minutes). After activation, reconstitute the concentrate in whatever volume of alcohol desired.

 

Let us know if you have any further questions. If you want to see the difference, save some of the original tincture, perform the steps above, save the modified tincture, and give us a call!

Edited April 15, 2012 by Cannalytics

[+Green Cross]

Muchly appreciated. Considered trying to decarbox existing herb-alcohol slush via boiling sealed Mason jars in my canning tub. Basic canning. Hoping upon opening jars their CO2 would evacuate immediately. Or, would CO2 remain in solution due to pressurization so the jars need shaking to evacuate it? Anywhere, your way resolves that.

 

I'd say the safest thing to do would be to evaporate the alcohol with the lid off so you don't have to worry about building up too much pressure that may shatter the glass. Then heat the material for 300degF at 15 minutes (this time and temp only works if both the oven AND the decarboxylation surface are pre-heated;...