17 replies to this topic

[The Digital Nomad]

http://www.macombdai...8f095124666.txt

undercover buys again, with fake ID

-
Michigan Attorney General Bill Schuette is again trying to shut down a Chesterfield Township medical marijuana dispensary, claiming it sold marijuana outside the rules of the law.

Judge John Foster scheduled a Feb. 13 show-cause hearing for attorneys to argue Schuette’s claim Big Daddy’s Hydroponics and Compassion Center violated the law when it sold marijuana to an undercover officer armed with a medical marijuana license but who didn’t list Big Daddy’s as his caregiver.

Schutte in a motion filed Wednesday in Macomb County Circuit Court in Mount Clemens asks Foster “to order the occupants vacate the property; the business be padlocked for a period of one year; the illegal contraband destroyed pursuant to law; and all contents of the premises be removed and sold.”

He also seeks a $7,500 fine or 93 days in jail, as allowed by the law.

The request comes as part of an ongoing legal battle between Big Daddy’s on Gratiot Avenue and Chesterfield Township, which was joined by Schuette, over the 2008 Medical Marijuana Act passed by voters in 2008. The act allows people to register as a patient or caregiver; a caregiver can produce marijuana for personal use and five other licensed patients.

Schuette and the township argue that a caregiver must supply a specific five people who name the caregiver on their cards, while Big Daddy’s contends that a caregiver can provide to any five licensed patients.

Schuette says that on Jan, 25, undercover cop James Ruthenberg, a Harper Woods police officer who has worked on the County of Macomb Enforcement Team, the anti-drug unit, purchased a $20 membership at Big Daddy’s using a fictitious identification and corresponding MMA patient license and bought 6.2 grams, $60 worth, of “Bubba Kush” marijuana from a caregiver “Katie.” Ruthenberg did not name anyone as a caregiver on his card.

Big Daddy’s attorney Corbett O’Meara, said Friday he will not contest the facts of the case but that Katie’s actions were legal. He said this situation has not been resolved by the courts.

“The plain language of the Act allows it,” O’Meara said. “It’s our contention that this issue has not been specifically resolved. This is exactly the issue that needs to be resolved.”

The case is scheduled for trial the next day in front of Foster on the zoning issues, but O’Meara said that it could be delayed because whoever loses Schuette’s request likely will appeal to the state Court of Appeals"


DN

[Croppled1]

So now the existance of our Farmers Market is at Stake but a dispensary will be the head of the beast on display . It says the employee caught in the middle was a caregiver but the patient was a fake . I so wanted to see a market at least once . I guess I should have faith patient needs and common sense will prevail over discrimination in the end .

Further hopefully a caregiver can dispense to anyone connected by record in the registry or whom would qualify under medical need at the time of transfer * . I think the article has it wrong .


* section 8 court appearance would be required if both parties did not have recommendations with cards and some courts are not accepting it .

Edited by Croppled1, 05 February 2012 - 12:37 PM.

[cristinew]

This is part of the reason our state legislature is at work in modifying this act Bill S and Walsh think that the law is that only get your meds from your caregiver or grow your own, that what they think the law is, But they have to change the law to make it certain..

Edited by cristinew, 05 February 2012 - 10:06 AM.

[The Digital Nomad]

Croppled1, on 05 February 2012 - 09:58 AM, said:

So now the existance of our Farmers Market is at Stake but a dispensary will be the head of the beast on display . It says the employee caught in the middle was a caregiver but the patient was a fake . I so wanted to see a market at least once . I guess I should have faith patient needs and common sense will prevail over discrimination in the end .

the crux of that issue is - can LEO use fake IDs to convict people. So far Judge Foster is only considering that LEO behavior for information purposes, not criminal charges. The judge said the LEO lying to a doctor and signing a application to the MDCH attesting its truth - was shady and may not hold in HIS court.

If ONLY legitimate patients and CGs had cards or legal paperwork then the farmer's market has no issues.

DN

[NotKidRock]

The Digital Nomad, on 05 February 2012 - 10:10 AM, said:

the crux of that issue is - can LEO use fake IDs to convict people.

Plus the fact the fake card had "NO CAREGIVER" written on back. How does Schuette think the patient is supposed to get access to meds with no caregiver?! Paients need safe access somewhere.

[cristinew]

It may have been that the cop had a condition to get the card I do not know, Walsh said that he believed that a caregiver can only support his patients, I guess we will know soon how the law changes to enforce that idea,

[Croppled1]

cristinew, on 05 February 2012 - 10:02 AM, said:

This is part of the reason our state legislature is at work in modifying this act Bill S and Walsh think that the law is that only get your meds from your caregiver or grow your own, that what they think the law is, But they have to change the law to make it certain..

Bill Schuette has repeated over and over he does not acknowledge the existence of medical cannabis . He only abused it recreationally then recovered and wants his free pass and the matter closed but you and I should rot in jail having our medical routines interrupted putting us at risk of death under threat of felonies even when trying to follow the Michigan Medical Marijuana Act and every other law in the State . He must injure people in court to resolve the issue . It can't be talked out , tolerated and reasonabley implemented in a truly workable fashion .

As patients we already have dozens of drugs being used on us without proper comfortable detoxification offered or even understood and possible .Let alone accessible and attempted in a non punitive and non offensive manner . What is out there is barbaric , doesn't work because of unreasonable customerry and necessary time limits and often ridiculous set up only for the profit of the licensed professionals that run them with over 50 % recidivism rates . Many of us know the truth and live in fear daily . Now we have to worry about reprocussions in Emergency Rooms because officials will not implement this act in good faith and educate professionals involved . Asprin is willow bark and yes I chew it for sore throat just like Marinol is a poor arfifical substitute for Cannabis but you can treat patients on it the same . There is no reason for distraction from patients real medical issues .

That is where the real crime is that some including Schuette have supported and passed laws protecting insurance companies from liabilities to treat patients properly and create a proper in patient system for patients whom have problems with dependent medications and that isn't limited to narcotics , abuse or always require detox when people are in pain that has to be treated . Some people suffer that much . Unfair treatment and regulations of patients on dependent medications has been the real fuel that pushed the whole medical cannabis issue over the top . Cannabis is a benign safe herb compared to the current FDA fiasco's out there it can help one taper from . It is time Schuette and Government recognized the medical value and over the counter saftey of Cannabis . It is time patients had proper support on the real issues that are causing problems . It is time we recognized the path of least harm may be different based on individual medical situations .

Edited by Croppled1, 05 February 2012 - 12:29 PM.

[washtenaut]

The Digital Nomad, on 05 February 2012 - 10:10 AM, said:

the crux of that issue is - can LEO use fake IDs to convict people. So far Judge Foster is only considering that LEO behavior for information purposes, not criminal charges. The judge said the LEO lying to a doctor and signing a application to the MDCH attesting its truth - was shady and may not hold in HIS court.

If ONLY legitimate patients and CGs had cards or legal paperwork then the farmer's market has no issues.

DN

For this case, perhaps the fake ID is most important but in my opinion, the crux of the issue is a caregiver providing overages to other patients and caregivers in the registry but outside of the max 5 patients that can designate that caregiver.

As is my way, I wrote a letter if anyone wants to use any or all in sending to their own rep or senator. It might help. The following link will point you right to your reps by your zipcode.

congress.org


------------------

Dear Senator xxx,

Imagine you stop by the pharmacy one evening only to learn that they don’t have the medicine on hand to control your spouse’s seizures. They have run out. Abruptly stopping seizure medicine can create a very serious health situation but you’re not too worried because another branch of the pharmacy will surely be able to fill the prescription, right?

The pharmacist apologizes profusely but informs you that because of new legislation, all patients may now only get their prescriptions filled from a single branch of a pharmacy. You are told that the medicine will be in sometime in the next couple of months.

If House Bill 4850 is passed, this ‘unacceptable’ scenario will play out for thousands of medical marijuana patients all across Michigan – epileptics, chronic pain patients, and Multiple Sclerosis sufferers, among others.

Growing medical cannabis can take several months. Tomorrow, if you learned that you had stage 3 or 4 cancer, would you mind waiting those months before beginning your treatment? If a patient’s grow suddenly dies from pests or if they’ve assigned a caregiver whose power has gone out for 38 hours in January, their planned supply of medicine for the next few months has suddenly disappeared.

Compassionate people understand that these patients cannot be expected to simply do without their medication. The patients and their caregivers must have alternatives in order to ensure an uninterrupted supply of medicine. Transfers between unaffiliated patients and caregivers must be allowed to continue.

Please vote against House Bill 4850 and encourage your colleagues to do so as well. Thank you for your help with this very important issue.

Sincerely,

[newbie313]

Nice

[Croppled1]

washtenaut, on 05 February 2012 - 11:18 AM, said:

For this case, perhaps the fake ID is most important but in my opinion, the crux of the issue is a caregiver providing overages to other patients and caregivers in the registry but outside of the max 5 patients that can designate that caregiver.

As is my way, I wrote a letter if anyone wants to use any or all in sending to their own rep or senator. It might help. The following link will point you right to your reps by your zipcode.

congress.org


------------------

Dear Senator xxx,

Imagine you stop by the pharmacy one evening only to learn that they don’t have the medicine on hand to control your spouse’s seizures. They have run out. Abruptly stopping seizure medicine can create a very serious health situation but you’re not too worried because another branch of the pharmacy will surely be able to fill the prescription, right?

The pharmacist apologizes profusely but informs you that because of new legislation, all patients may now only get their prescriptions filled from a single branch of a pharmacy. You are told that the medicine will be in sometime in the next couple of months.

If House Bill 4850 is passed, this ‘unacceptable’ scenario will play out for thousands of medical marijuana patients all across Michigan – epileptics, chronic pain patients, and Multiple Sclerosis sufferers, among others.

Growing medical cannabis can take several months. Tomorrow, if you learned that you had stage 3 or 4 cancer, would you mind waiting those months before beginning your treatment? If a patient’s grow suddenly dies from pests or if they’ve assigned a caregiver whose power has gone out for 38 hours in January, their planned supply of medicine for the next few months has suddenly disappeared.

Compassionate people understand that these patients cannot be expected to simply do without their medication. The patients and their caregivers must have alternatives in order to ensure an uninterrupted supply of medicine. Transfers between unaffiliated patients and caregivers must be allowed to continue.

Please vote against House Bill 4850 and encourage your colleagues to do so as well. Thank you for your help with this very important issue.

Sincerely,

Your on your A game as usual a good one for load into the email o matic . It is possible to use it by starting out with another letter then clearing it and pasting in this one . For those wanting to you can copy text on this site when its in the preview window .

[greenbuddha]

I think if I were to start up a 'medical marijuana' supply company of 'any' sort, I'd probably choose a name that might grab 'less' attention from the anti-cannabis crowd, perhaps something like' Green Grow', or something similar.

Throw it their face, and... well.

But that's just me... and MTCW

[blueberry]

The appeals court has already ruled on cg/pt transfers and were clear in their decision. And thu the problem. Because the law has not been implemented and is being undermined, the government is subservient to Bill Schuette. Perhaps these local politicians should ask themselves if they really want to be tethered to someone who has been bounced out of national politics. Anyways here's the decision from McQueen. The justices were direct and correct.


Here the justices first say that 4e is a valid transfer and does not represent a "sale". This is the linchpin of their argument.

First, § 4(e) authorizes a registered primary caregiver to receive compensation for costs
associated with assisting a registered qualifying patient in the medical use of marihuana. MCL
333.26424(e). However, § 4(e) goes on to state that “[a]ny such compensation shall not
constitute the sale of controlled substances.” Id. This quoted sentence would not be needed if
the definition of the “medical use” of marihuana included the “sale” of marihuana. No statutory
provision should be rendered nugatory. Apsey v Mem Hosp, 477 Mich 120, 131; 730 NW2d 695
(2007). Consequently, § 4(e) actually supports the conclusion that the “medical use” of
marihuana does not include the “sale” of marihuana.

Now the famous footnote 16 which clearly states that 4e is medical use and was not relevant to McQueen. Medical use is what is protected by the Act. Sorry Bill, remedial reading classes can be had reasonably. Thanks, bb

See MCL 333.26424(e) (“A registered primary caregiver may
receive compensation for costs associated with assisting a registered qualifying patient in the
medical use of marihuana.”). Also, in regard to § 4(e), the parties disagree whether a registered
primary caregiver may receive compensation for the costs associated with assisting any
registered qualifying patient in the “medical use” of marihuana or whether a registered primary
caregiver may only receive compensation for assisting the qualifying patients with whom he or
she is connected through the MDCH registry process. Because of our conclusion that the
“medical use” of marihuana does not include the “sale” of marihuana, we need not, and therefore
do not, resolve this dispute.

[free country 420]

i thought getting a med card was a misdemeanor if gotten under false pretenses

[AlternativeSolutionsPlus]

By Jameson Cook
Macomb Daily Staff Writer

Michigan Attorney General Bill Schuette is again trying to shut down a Chesterfield Township medical marijuana dispensary, claiming it sold marijuana outside the rules of the law.

Judge John Foster scheduled a Feb. 13 show-cause hearing for attorneys to argue Schuette’s claim Big Daddy’s Hydroponics and Compassion Center violated the law when it sold marijuana to an undercover officer armed with a medical marijuana license but who didn’t list Big Daddy’s as his caregiver.

Schutte in a motion filed Wednesday in Macomb County Circuit Court in Mount Clemens asks Foster “to order the occupants vacate the property; the business be padlocked for a period of one year; the illegal contraband destroyed pursuant to law; and all contents of the premises be removed and sold.”

He also seeks a $7,500 fine or 93 days in jail, as allowed by the law.

The request comes as part of an ongoing legal battle between Big Daddy’s on Gratiot Avenue and Chesterfield Township, which was joined by Schuette, over the 2008 Medical Marijuana Act passed by voters in 2008. The act allows people to register as a patient or caregiver; a caregiver can produce marijuana for personal use and five other licensed patients.

Schuette and the township argue that a caregiver must supply a specific five people who name the caregiver on their cards, while Big Daddy’s contends that a caregiver can provide to any five licensed patients.

Schuette says that on Jan, 25, undercover cop James Ruthenberg, a Harper Woods police officer who has worked on the County of Macomb Enforcement Team, the anti-drug unit, purchased a $20 membership at Big Daddy’s using a fictitious identification and corresponding MMA patient license and bought 6.2 grams, $60 worth, of “Bubba Kush” marijuana from a caregiver “Katie.” Ruthenberg did not name anyone as a caregiver on his card.

Big Daddy’s attorney Corbett O’Meara, said Friday he will not contest the facts of the case but that Katie’s actions were legal. He said this situation has not been resolved by the courts.

“The plain language of the Act allows it,” O’Meara said. “It’s our contention that this issue has not been specifically resolved. This is exactly the issue that needs to be resolved.”

The case is scheduled for trial the next day in front of Foster on the zoning issues, but O’Meara said that it could be delayed because whoever loses Schuette’s request likely will appeal to the state Court of Appeals.

The township sued Big Daddy’s in July.

Foster on Nov. 30 ordered Big Daddy’s to not produce, possess or exchange marijuana on its premises. In December, he clarified it to say the facility could keep and sell marijuana within the rules of the MMA. Zoning and occupancy issues remain.

http://www.ourmidlan...0fbd87952f.html

Edited by AlternativeSolutionsPlus, 06 February 2012 - 08:05 AM.

[The Digital Nomad]

AlternativeSolutionsPlus, on 06 February 2012 - 08:05 AM, said:

By Jameson Cook
Macomb Daily Staff Writer

Michigan Attorney General Bill Schuette is again trying to shut down a Chesterfield Township medical marijuana dispensary, claiming it sold marijuana outside the rules of the law.

Judge John Foster scheduled a Feb. 13 show-cause hearing for attorneys to argue Schuette’s claim Big Daddy’s Hydroponics and Compassion Center violated the law when it sold marijuana to an undercover officer armed with a medical marijuana license but who didn’t list Big Daddy’s as his caregiver.

Schutte in a motion filed Wednesday in Macomb County Circuit Court in Mount Clemens asks Foster “to order the occupants vacate the property; the business be padlocked for a period of one year; the illegal contraband destroyed pursuant to law; and all contents of the premises be removed and sold.”

He also seeks a $7,500 fine or 93 days in jail, as allowed by the law.

The request comes as part of an ongoing legal battle between Big Daddy’s on Gratiot Avenue and Chesterfield Township, which was joined by Schuette, over the 2008 Medical Marijuana Act passed by voters in 2008. The act allows people to register as a patient or caregiver; a caregiver can produce marijuana for personal use and five other licensed patients.

Schuette and the township argue that a caregiver must supply a specific five people who name the caregiver on their cards, while Big Daddy’s contends that a caregiver can provide to any five licensed patients.

Schuette says that on Jan, 25, undercover cop James Ruthenberg, a Harper Woods police officer who has worked on the County of Macomb Enforcement Team, the anti-drug unit, purchased a $20 membership at Big Daddy’s using a fictitious identification and corresponding MMA patient license and bought 6.2 grams, $60 worth, of “Bubba Kush” marijuana from a caregiver “Katie.” Ruthenberg did not name anyone as a caregiver on his card.

Big Daddy’s attorney Corbett O’Meara, said Friday he will not contest the facts of the case but that Katie’s actions were legal. He said this situation has not been resolved by the courts.

“The plain language of the Act allows it,” O’Meara said. “It’s our contention that this issue has not been specifically resolved. This is exactly the issue that needs to be resolved.”

The case is scheduled for trial the next day in front of Foster on the zoning issues, but O’Meara said that it could be delayed because whoever loses Schuette’s request likely will appeal to the state Court of Appeals.

The township sued Big Daddy’s in July.

Foster on Nov. 30 ordered Big Daddy’s to not produce, possess or exchange marijuana on its premises. In December, he clarified it to say the facility could keep and sell marijuana within the rules of the MMA. Zoning and occupancy issues remain.

http://www.ourmidlan...0fbd87952f.html

Posted yesterday, use that thread pls - DN

[The Digital Nomad]

bumped

[The Digital Nomad]

Update -

You can expect Big Daddy to rally all activist to protest on Feb 13th in Mt Clemens. Meet at 10am and we protest at 1pm. Car pool as the locations are close.

Contact Big Daddy chesterfield - they also have a event for feb 11th 6pm to 10pm!

DN

[bobandtorey]

washtenaut, on 05 February 2012 - 11:18 AM, said:

For this case, perhaps the fake ID is most important but in my opinion, the crux of the issue is a caregiver providing overages to other patients and caregivers in the registry but outside of the max 5 patients that can designate that caregiver.

As is my way, I wrote a letter if anyone wants to use any or all in sending to their own rep or senator. It might help. The following link will point you right to your reps by your zipcode.

congress.org


------------------

Dear Senator xxx,

Imagine you stop by the pharmacy one evening only to learn that they don’t have the medicine on hand to control your spouse’s seizures. They have run out. Abruptly stopping seizure medicine can create a very serious health situation but you’re not too worried because another branch of the pharmacy will surely be able to fill the prescription, right?

The pharmacist apologizes profusely but informs you that because of new legislation, all patients may now only get their prescriptions filled from a single branch of a pharmacy. You are told that the medicine will be in sometime in the next couple of months.

If House Bill 4850 is passed, this ‘unacceptable’ scenario will play out for thousands of medical marijuana patients all across Michigan – epileptics, chronic pain patients, and Multiple Sclerosis sufferers, among others.

Growing medical cannabis can take several months. Tomorrow, if you learned that you had stage 3 or 4 cancer, would you mind waiting those months before beginning your treatment? If a patient’s grow suddenly dies from pests or if they’ve assigned a caregiver whose power has gone out for 38 hours in January, their planned supply of medicine for the next few months has suddenly disappeared.

Compassionate people understand that these patients cannot be expected to simply do without their medication. The patients and their caregivers must have alternatives in order to ensure an uninterrupted supply of medicine. Transfers between unaffiliated patients and caregivers must be allowed to continue.

Please vote against House Bill 4850 and encourage your colleagues to do so as well. Thank you for your help with this very important issue.

Sincerely,

i agree when i first came here long ago we all talked about were we were going to get are Meds from and back then we all new that we could get are meds from any one but the person in witch we were to get them from would be in trouble not us thats the way we thought it to be at that time