Mmma Limits Make Me Cringe

[iwombat]

Relative newbie here, so first let me apologize if I say anything that roils the waters...

 

Born and raised in MI, I went to work in CA for 25 years and just returned recently.

Was an 'official' CA Prop 215 patient since a double spinal fusion in 2007, but used it medicinally

for at least 10 years beforehand, trying to postpone the inevitable surgery.

 

I've been lurking here for awhile and it seems that a lot of the difficulty/stress of being

a patient/caregiver in MI comes from trying to keep your medication amounts within the

paltry legal limits here.

 

In California, 8 ounces is the default CA Prop 215 limit for patients, but many

counties like mine (Santa Cruz County) allow patients to possess 3 pounds and

cultivate a 10x10 foot garden indoors or out.

 

Here is an except of Santa Cruz MM Ordinance Section 7.124 from 2004:

 

5. For the purposes of this ordinance, the Santa Cruz County Board of 

Supervisors finds and determines that three (3) pounds of dried cannabis bud or its 

conversion per year is a reasonable amount for medical marijuana patients to possess and 

consume, absent a demonstrated medically recommended need for an amount greater than 

three pounds per year. 

 

6. For the purpose of this chapter, the Santa Cruz County Board of Supervisors 

finds and determines that a one-hundred (100) square foot canopy of mature female 

cannabis plants grown outdoors will typically yield three (3) pounds of dried and 

processed cannabis bud per year regardless of the number of marijuana plants. 

 

This was based on the recommendation of a panel of physicians:

 

Our group agreed that our recommendations to you should try to accomplish two things: 

first, to reflect an amount of marijuana sacient to provide for the needs of most patients 

using it medically, and second, be flexible enough to allow for the needs of patients 

requiring a greater amount. 

 

Based on the information above and on the clinical experience of the physicians in our 

group we recommend an amount of three pounds of mature product and a growing area 

of 100 square feet. Patients requiring a greater amount should be able to possess a 

greater amount if recommended by their physician. Three pounds of processed marijuana 

equates to 3.7 marijuana cigarettes per day. The majority of clinicians in our group felt 

that that amount is sufficient for the needs of most patients. One member felt that a limit 

of four and one half pounds and 150 square feet of growing area would be more 

appropriate, but that physician agreed to join in the consensus of the group in 

recommending three pounds and 100 square feet. All the clinicians recognize that some 

patients may require a higher dose than allowed by the recommended guidelines, and our 

group strongly encourages allowing physicians the ability to recommend a greater 

amount. 

 

Reference:

http://sccounty01.co.santa-cruz.ca.us/BDS/GovStream2/BDSvData/non_legacy/agendas/2004/20041019/PDF/010.pdf

 

Sec 7.124 was amended in 2013 to encourage large growers to be more rural, but the

patient limits remain the same.

 

Reference:

http://sccounty01.co.santa-cruz.ca.us/BDS/GovStream2/BDSvData/non_legacy/Minutes/2013/20131210/PDF/013.pdf

 

Even the law is fairly forgiving there unless you are carting around a pickup truck full.  The

official Santa Cruz Sherif's policy is to confiscate anything over 3 pounds and then

consider whether to charge you with a misdemeanor:

 

c. When a deputy encounters a subject who fits the "patient" or "caregiver"

criteria but the amount of marijuana possessed is more than the guideline

amount, deputies should cite and release the suspect(s) for Santa Cruz

County Code 7.124.105.  Santa Cruz County Code 7.124.105 allows

patients to possess up to three (3) pounds of processed marijuana annually

and one hundred (100) square feet of plant growing canopy for medical

needs.  If the patient exceeds the above guidelines, absent a

recommendation allowing excess processed marijuana, the person could

be cited for violation of Santa Cruz County Code 7.124.105, a

misdemeanor.  The amount of marijuana that exceeds the guideline

amount will be seized and booked as evidence.

 

 

Reference:

http://cannabislawinstitute.com/cli/Santa_Cruz_files/Santa%20Cruz%20Sheriff%20Policy%20O.132%20Medical%20Marijuana%20Investigation.pdf

 

Serious patients there can buy a year's worth of medicine at a per pound price and

are free to make effective concentrates or medibles for themselves without fear of

being persecuted as drug manufacturers.

 

Patient to patient transfers are not a big deal as long as everyone has documentation

and stays below the three pound limit.  Dispensaries are legal and can buy your

overages without issue.  How can you know how much plant X will produce before

you grow it?  Patients can grow their allotment of plants and if it produces more

than they can legally keep, they simply sell it to other patients or a dispensary to

defray their costs.

 

I just want to say that I feel for you all, and now myself, because MMMA limits

just seem inadequate for many types of patients (cancer, epilepsy, autism)

and those seeking serious pain relief.  Being a caregiver here seems to come

with a lot of stress that you guys simply don't deserve.  Even as a patient I'm

nervous.

 

More than legalization, I hope for the adoption of reasonable and uniform MM

patient guidelines across all states so that the wisdom of decades of MM usage

and experience and the rapidly changing landscape of MM treatments and treated

conditions does not need to be lethargically re-learned by every county in the nation

at the usual bureaucratic pace.

 

And world peace...

Edited August 24, 2014 by iwombat

[t-pain]

i agree, 2.5oz is low.

 

calif supreme court just said cities can ban dispensaries if they want. so you might have outdated info...

[Wild Bill]

Here's a little background info on what happened here.

 

http://www.cannabisculture.com/content/2011/12/01/Michigan-Medical-Marijuana-Law-Destroyed-Dow-Baby-Attorney-General

Edited August 24, 2014 by Wild Bill

[iwombat]

Nothing is perfect, of course.  I could not take my permitted 3 pounds of medicine and drive up

to Sonoma (also permits 3 pounds) for the weekend because I'd have to drive through San Jose

and San Francisco on the way and they only permit 8 oz.  So even within CA, the need for patients

to be treated uniformly is not satisfied.

 

BTW, cities can ban dispensaries, but they can't ban patients and they can't cut down the

states medical allowances, only increase them.  You just drive 5 minutes to the next city to

buy unless you are rural.

[iwombat]

Thank's Wild Bill.  When's the next Schuette re-election rally?

[GregS]

Ty. Nice stuff.

 

We, as you likely know, are still going through a number of growing pains with our law. I hope you have to offer and we can learn from what appears to be some great experience. 

 

But you're still a nugget here until you make us laugh. 

 

Welcome nugget.

Edited August 24, 2014 by GregS

[iwombat]

Wisdom mostly eludes me, but at least I have experience going for me.

[Restorium2]

As far a Schuette goes, imagine his mind on; All of us growing like wild dogs behind his back. Piles and piles of sticky buds just stacking higher and higher in our stashes. 5 years of it so far. Bwa Ha Ha. He hates it that we get to grow at home. Too late now Schuette, we will never run out in this lifetime. The price for the attack is huge stashes. No one could just relax and grow what they needed with the act in constant attack. Michigan is the Sticky Stash State. You will find the best stashes on the planet here in Michigan.

[Restorium2]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[beourbud]

Well, the problem is the disp and concentrate folks dont really care what the law says.  They blatantly defy the law which in turn makes it harder for us legitimate patients trying to work within the law.

 

There are still disp that are No better than a drug house.  They are not selling meds they are selling dope  to whoever they can.

 

Even the High Times Cup was a front for pushing recreational pot and illegal concentrates.  They promoted free samples and did in fact give out concentrates.  It was all about recreational and selling their wares.

 

I witnessed a a vendor pushing his concentrate (diesel fuel)  on a friend of mine,(an asthmatic).  the vendor was pushing dope not meds...he did not ask if the patient had any conditions which might have a negative reaction,  he was just pushin dope..  My friend tried some from the vape the vendor had and immediately went into a asthma attack,  unable to catch his breath.  The vendor laughed and said thats some good bunny muffin eh? .  What a fraud,  posing as med but just a fkn drug dealer.  We had to take him to urgent care for treatment.  The vendors dont care about anyone but themselves and profit.

 

Some of the seminars were good but it was way to hot in there.

 

I am reserving many unlawful acts we observed  at the event....Not a narc.  But if the concentrate folk persist to push their illegal dope all bets are off.

 

The rain was an obvious act of God.

 

Dont be fooled...Concentrates are dangerous in the wrong hands. and should remain illegal to transfer until sufficient testing can be done.  Till then warn you loved ones.

 

We the People Voted for our law.  We dont need the cartels or any other financially motivated group to exploit our good patients.

 

I find it suspicious many here would not attend the cup, choosing instead to gather outside the event.  Why?  Because they knew it might be raided.

 

My sources tell me  many of the vendors and organizers are being investigated.

 

If you like cali or colo or wash law.....live there.   Leave us Michiganders to decide for ourselves what WE want.

 

If you want safe access...stay away from disp and those pushing concentrates...the boom is coming down and there is going to be collateral damage.

 

Dont let it be You!

[beourbud]

Oh and Get Out and Vote Every fknrepublican OUT of office if you want change..

 

Sitting at your puter wringing your hands gets you nowhere

[Restorium2]

Well, the problem is the disp and concentrate folks dont really care what the law says.  They blatantly defy the law which in turn makes it harder for us legitimate patients trying to work within the law.

 

There are still disp that are No better than a drug house.  They are not selling meds they are selling dope  to whoever they can.

 

Even the High Times Cup was a front for pushing recreational pot and illegal concentrates.  They promoted free samples and did in fact give out concentrates.  It was all about recreational and selling their wares.

 

I witnessed a a vendor pushing his concentrate (diesel fuel)  on a friend of mine,(an asthmatic).  the vendor was pushing dope not meds...he did not ask if the patient had any conditions which might have a negative reaction,  he was just pushin dope..  My friend tried some from the vape the vendor had and immediately went into a asthma attack,  unable to catch his breath.  The vendor laughed and said thats some good bunny muffin eh? .  What a fraud,  posing as med but just a fkn drug dealer.  We had to take him to urgent care for treatment.  The vendors dont care about anyone but themselves and profit.

 

Some of the seminars were good but it was way to hot in there.

 

I am reserving many unlawful acts we observed  at the event....Not a narc.  But if the concentrate folk persist to push their illegal dope all bets are off.

 

The rain was an obvious act of God.

 

Dont be fooled...Concentrates are dangerous in the wrong hands. and should remain illegal to transfer until sufficient testing can be done.  Till then warn you loved ones.

 

We the People Voted for our law.  We dont need the cartels or any other financially motivated group to exploit our good patients.

 

I find it suspicious many here would not attend the cup, choosing instead to gather outside the event.  Why?  Because they knew it might be raided.

 

My sources tell me  many of the vendors and organizers are being investigated.

 

If you like cali or colo or wash law.....live there.   Leave us Michiganders to decide for ourselves what WE want.

 

If you want safe access...stay away from disp and those pushing concentrates...the boom is coming down and there is going to be collateral damage.

 

Dont let it be You!

So you let your friend the asthmatic smoke everything and anything that gets put in front of his face? I think you share a lot of the blame for your friends discomfort.

 

We all understand by now you personally don't use any concentrates so you want to bash them and any patients that want to use them. If it aint for you it aint no good. I'm getting it loud and clear.

[beourbud]

So you let your friend the asthmatic smoke everything and anything that gets put in front of his face? I think you share a lot of the blame for your friends discomfort.

 

We all understand by now you personally don't use any concentrates so you want to bash them and any patients that want to use them. If it aint for you it aint no good. I'm getting it loud and clear.

I have used concentrates before they were illegal...i am sure there is med benifiet but there needs to be extensive research before it is release onto the public....you know like Vioxx.   Pharma was quick to release ase a miracle drug,  turns out it killed more than it helped....we dont want that DO WE?

He dont need a babysitter.

 

Concentrates are illegal scarface...get a grip

 

Furthermore concentrates are coming from out of state and canada...screw that

Edited August 25, 2014 by beourbud

[Restorium2]

concentrates are illegal  scarface...get a grip

So was marijuana most all of my life. Good and bad are not decided by legal or illegal when it comes to marijuana. It never was the case and is not now.

 

Did the MMMA somehow change some kinds of marijuana, miraculously, at the date and time our law was signed? Was it raised up on high because of a law? Born again cannabis? Wait, some of it is still bad! Let us analyze the law to decide which is good and bad.

 

Revelation; Medical Marijuana has been here in Michigan before 12/08.

[Restorium2]

I have used concentrates before they were illegal...i am sure there is med benifiet but there needs to be extensive research before it is release onto the public....you know like Vioxx.   Pharma was quick to release ase a miracle drug,  turns out it killed more than it helped....we dont want that DO WE?

He dont need a babysitter.

 

Concentrates are illegal scarface...get a grip

WOW. You just keep editing.

 

Concentrates are the same as your marijuana. Just stronger. Not like VIOXX stupid. You have been around too long to just be called ignorant.

[beourbud]

We voted for MMJ.......NOT disp or concentrates

 

We the People are sick of the drug dealers semantic gymnastics.

 

We Voted to Grow our own or have a caregiver grow for us.   Not drug dealin pot shops

[shishka]

Born again cannabis lol, I like that one...

 

I voted for med dealing pot shops.

[Restorium2]

We voted for MMJ.......NOT disp or concentrates

 

We the People are sick of the drug dealers semantic gymnastics.

 

We Voted to Grow our own or have a caregiver grow for us.   Not drug dealin pot shops

Come on now. 'Preparations there of' are spelled out right in the law. You are playing stupid again. Everyone voted for concentrates.

[beourbud]

WOW. You just keep editing.

 

Concentrates are the same as your marijuana. Just stronger. Not like VIOXX stupid. You have been around too long to just be called ignorant.

Oxygen is good for you too but in concentration can be lethal.....suck on that jr

 

Concentrates can be dangerous to manufacture and dangerous to consume....we need research

Edited August 25, 2014 by beourbud

[+washtenaut]

When cannabis was legal medicine in this country it was very often used in a concentrated form.

 

Some illnesses respond very well to smoked cannabis but many do not.  Very often patients cannot smoke or vape enough raw material to get the desired medical impact.

[Restorium2]

Born again cannabis lol, I like that one...

 

I voted for med dealing pot shops.

My opinion is people voted YES because they didn't want to vote NO. You could have put any words you wanted around the word marijuana and the vote would have been YES for around 63%. The wording was for after it passed when all the people in charge who voted NO couldn't totally reject the law.

[beourbud]

Come on now. 'Preparations there of' are spelled out right in the law. You are playing stupid again. Everyone voted for concentrates.

Read the cases and rulings COA perry mason

[beourbud]

.

 

I voted for med dealing pot shops.

You lost

[Restorium2]

Oxygen is good for you too but in concentration can be lethal.....suck on that jr

 

Concentrates can be dangerous to manufacture and dangerous to consume....we need research

You are a bad propaganda machine. It's a good thing you are terrible at it. Just slow down and think about who's throats you are cutting right now. You are slashing and burning your only allies. At some point you just might need us. No man is an island even if he's sitting on a huge green house full of plants ready to harvest.

[Restorium2]

Read the cases and rulings COA perry mason

So it's you and the COA against the rest of us? Seriously?