Twist On A Caregiver

[Habenero]

Mibrains can you post the court case where the supreme court said that please. I do remember that too but question in my mind is how narrow is that.

[mibrains]

sure...

its part of the Mcqueen decision.

 

not many of us understood it at the time..i certainly did not.

 

now we can only quote it and make people aware that it is a one sided agreement.

 

http://medicalmarijuana.procon.org/sourcefiles/state-of-michigan-vs-mcqueen.pdf

 

page 18

 

60

Of course, a registered qualifying patient who acquires marijuana—whether from another registered qualifying patient or even from someone who is not entitled to possess marijuana—to alleviate his own condition can still receive immunity from arrest, prosecution, or penalty because the § 4(d) presumption cannot be rebutted on that basis. In this sense, § 4 immunity is asymmetric: it allows a registered qualifying patient to obtain marijuana for his own medical use but does not allow him to transfer marijuana for another registered qualifying patient’s use.

[mibrains]

This may be a swell reason to suggest to new patients ways of locating a suitable caregiver quickly and safely? Sending them off with the thought they can stroll into a dispensary and be all safe is possibly misleading, and at least not the best scenario advice.

Patients have been raided at these points of sales too. Their personal records are not protected at an illegal dispensary.

 

their personal records do not matter as a course of the Mi supreme court.

 

they are not able to prosecute a patient for acquiring cannabis from any source.. however those selling or providing cannabis may be at risk..

 

patients are encouraged to acquire cannabis from any source.

 

so as a matter of fact a patient is protected to acquire cannabis from a dispensary.

 

if it suits their needs.. what would be the problem for the patient/buyer?

Edited September 30, 2014 by mibrains

[Habenero]

He can get immunity for his medical use but query, does he have immunity for the seller's illegal behavior he participated in?

[trichcycler]

The Act is a Cg/patient supported relationship. the intent is not to drive illegal sales or illicit drug marketing. The intent of the forum as I understand it is not to advise patients to test the laws, or count on every officer having an understanding of a past court case, rather to instruct them on ways to act safely and responsibly within the scope of the intended law and to participate in ways that do not support criminal behavior, criminal earnings, or criminal cartels shipping pot into these sales points.

The Act provides a suggested legal relationship between one cg and five patients, not the dealer and the ill.

 I do not believe ill people were to be used as tests. I regret that they followed ill advice and did not enjoy the freedoms from arrest or search or seizure.

 

I maintain the safest way of being supplied is to locate a suitable caregiver and register them as your supplier, as stated in our Act. of course this is my opinion and subject to ridicule and dissemination, like all of our opinions.

peace

[trichcycler]

by way of a safe, spelled out plan of registering with a suitable caregiver no ?

[trichcycler]

this is the way the Act treats carded people that sell to others that are not registered to them as their caregiver including dispensary salesmen;

 

(k) Any registered qualifying patient or registered primary caregiver who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act shall have his or her registry identification card revoked and is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both, in addition to any other penalties for the distribution of marihuana.

 

I suspect this would be enough to show that these types of non registered transactions are unacceptable, and should not be encouraged until they are acceptable, for best results.

I agree that the Act is supposed to protect patients regardless of where they get a supply, but the dispensary actions are expressly forbidden and outlawed, punishable by fines and jail time so why would we suggest supporting the behavior I wonder?

[Highlander]

this is the way the Act treats carded people that sell to others that are not registered to them as their caregiver including dispensary salesmen;(k) Any registered qualifying patient or registered primary caregiver who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act shall have his or her registry identification card revoked and is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both, in addition to any other penalties for the distribution of marihuana.I suspect this would be enough to show that these types of non registered transactions are unacceptable, and should not be encouraged until they are acceptable, for best results.I agree that the Act is supposed to protect patients regardless of where they get a supply, but the dispensary actions are expressly forbidden and outlawed, punishable by fines and jail time so why would we suggest supporting the behavior I wonder?

Please rethink this. It isn't about carded people selling to people not carded to them. It is about selling to someone not allowed to use MJ. H U G E difference.

[garyfisher]

section K states if you sell to non carded patients or patients who do not have a bona fida relationship with the doctor. .  It does not explicitly outlaw patient2patien or caregiver2patient

We're on the same page, Highlander.

 

 

Otherwise,  How is an out of state patient to acquire medicine?  We do have reciprocity law towards out of state carded patients.  

Edited October 1, 2014 by garyfisher

[Habenero]

Doesn't explicitly allow it either gary. The court said it's all illegal and you aren't protected unless the act gives you immunity.

[garyfisher]

I know of over a dozen dispensaries that stay open.  Some are within miles of MSP posts, others are right next door to oakland county sheriff.  It's all a bunch of hogwash.

[Habenero]

And like Mal said a few days ago, I bet you can point out some crack houses too. Doesn't mean they're legal.

[garyfisher]

Doesn't mean they aren't.

[garyfisher]

I mean, if you want to get down to the nit gritty, Fed law trumps local law; you're all breaking the law.  you're all under arrest.

[Habenero]

What mal said doesn't me they are illegal, it's what the supreme court said that makes them illegal.

[trichcycler]

I have thought about it much. I'm not prosecuting people for buying form a dispensary, only showing exactly how the law spells out a cg/patient relationship. Funny how that does not include dispensaries or unauthorized sales, and those salesmen are in violation of our law. To support them with purchases that are illegally provided is ludicrous when in the same breath one is attempting to support the Act itself. Intent is obvious, greed, illegal sales, not so much I think

[mibrains]

the way i see it is pretty simple.

 

the world is full of good apples and bad apples..

 

some people who are operating dispensaries are probably only interested in money.  capitalism at its finest.  please do not blame a person for seeking as much profit as possible.. that is the proven American way. 

 

some people who are operating dispensaries are actually interested in helping other people and maybe furthering cannabis reform.

 

dispensaries exist because people are using them.  they would not exist anywhere if people didn't want or need them.  hence the conclusion "some... many ... enough people must want them"

 

i am so excited to hear about the acres of cannabis growing in fields in CO

 

i can't wait to see Hemp growing in fields all across Michigan destined to be turned into bio-products and food.

 

a whole new era is upon us all.

 

it is time to all finally come together and help further this amazing plants ability to advance Human development and not hide behind the will of the "anti-cannabis" crowd.

[imiubu]

It's a dam catch 22.
Double edged blade with a real pointy end.

Just the way prohibitionist love it.

Provisioning centers are coming, in one form
or another.

I am against any prohibition of my choice of

well,
anything actually.

I don't care for what the money grabbers have
done to bring marijuana to where it is today.

I don't agree with all the pro marijuana; medical
or otherwise, and all their agendas.

We will never all agree at anytime on all things

Truth is, reform is coming and
it is a good time to be alive.
 

 

I tried the cg/ pt route a couple times.
It is not cost effective for either of us.

I've not had success growing my own... yet.
BUT, I (we) have that option.

I do like the convenience of dispensaries.
Pure and simple convenience.
Like a 7-11, you know you're going to pay more but...



I want provisioning centers.

Not at the cost of home growing.

Not at the cost of the CG/PT model.

 

 

The more options the better imho.
 

[garyfisher]

What mal said doesn't me they are illegal, it's what the supreme court said that makes them illegal.

And it's what genesee County says is legal:

 

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2014/09/flint_marijuana_dispensary_ord.html

[Habenero]

Last I knew Genesee county doesn't trump a supreme court ruling. State po po could go in and arrest and shut down any dispensary in Genesee county anytime they wanted.

[Highlander]

And it's what genesee County says is legal:

 

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2014/09/flint_marijuana_dispensary_ord.html

 

Do you know how the ordinance defines a dispensary?  Does it specifically indicate that transfers can be made to any cardholder?  Or is this like the City of Davison, which approved dispensaries as a place where a CG can transfer to one of his five patients?

[garyfisher]

Last I knew Genesee county doesn't trump a supreme court ruling. State po po could go in and arrest and shut down any dispensary in Genesee county anytime they wanted.

And my point with posting that is all marijuana use within the United States of America violates the controlled substance act.

 

Highlander,  I haven't reviewed the language but I assume it is open to sell to as many carded people as you want.  They operate a farmers market out there and it is wide open like this.

[Habenero]

Your point is meaningless when we're discussin what's legal under state law. So u got a meaningful point you wanna make?

[garyfisher]

[Habenero]

So right in the ordinance it says that dispensaries hafta comply with the mma. To me that means an dispensary can only service the cg's connected pts since the supreme court said that the mma doesn't allow unregistered transfers.