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Subcools Super Soil


budpuffer

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  i've been growing in hempy buckets,which is simply perlite and vermiculite in a bucket with a drain hole in it,along with FF nutes..it couldn't be easier but i've decided to try something new..i went on line and looked up organic soil recipes and found subcools supersoil..it looked good, so about 6 weeks ago i started gathering the stuff needed to try Subcools super soil which is a water only organic growing method.

   it takes 14 different ingredents to make up this "Super Soil" 15 if you include the water.. from crab meal to azomite,along with new 7 gal.containers and drain pans i must have spent $300-$400 bucks and hours on ebay and on the road getting this all together...now that was bad enough but after you get it all together you're got to mix it all together, which as it turns out isn't all that easy, in fact it's a pain...mixing and remixing until it's all perfect..but hey to get good organic meds i powered through it..

   now you might think i would be ready to drop those"souvenir only" award winning strain seeds i'd gotten from the attitude seedbank into their pots.. but you'd be wrong, you have to let the supersoil age for 6 weeks in a warm enviroment for the nurtirents to dissolve and microstructure to form...well i'm nothing if not patient and to get good organic meds i can wait a few weeks.

   now it's been all mixed together and aged for 4 weeks...you don't plant directly into Supersoil because it's to hot and would kill your seedlings, but rather layer the soil,,supersoil on the bottom and a good base soil on top that you plant your young plants into..so today i'm dropping some nuts..i'll get them germinated and established for awhile in small pots of base soil before i tranplant them into their supersoil pots which should cover the 2 weeks i'm missing on the "rest time" needed for the SS...7 strains from 7 different breeders..cup winners one and all,,,,oh i so excided,lol...at last i'm ready to get this project started.. 

    so after all this work and money i've got to ask,,am i the only one crazy enough to go through all this for good organic,water only meds?lol..is there anyone else growing in Supersoil? and if so will it be worth it?....i should tell you i'm not turning back at this point regardless of the feedback so please break any bad news to me gently....lol...bp

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I do the same with my recycled super soil. Most people are chucking their dirt at harvest long before it was even ready to plant in!

tip: if you foliar feed with your choice of nutrient you could cut your veg time in half, or veg till twice as large. I only suffered grow times in veg, never in flower. I did the above and match my hydro production now, with the added bonus of actually smelling all of those awesome terpenes hidden in the trichomes. The hit is richer, the smoke thicker, the flush is more naturally accomplished and successful. don't be afraid of the kabillion crawling insects you'll soon see in the dirt. without them the job would not get done.

 

freeload nematode by the boatload

rhapsode cathode electrode for the internode

no middle of the road toad spode

take the unhallowed carload to the zip code

the grow store payload for the commode

not an epode or a greek ode no workload

by the sevenfold I take the high road

not the byroad by the railroad for this episode

no download only upload the

word.......................................... nematode

 

what? don't ask me, I don't know where this chit comes from.

peace

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there are downsides to subcools "layering" method

 

as i researched subcools system and a few other "super" soils that require layering including the rev's system and i found there is one constant truth...

 

cannabis plant's roots do not enjoy "hot spots"

 

they (arguably) seem to prefer a consistent base soil that has everything they need mixed consistently within the primary base soil so that is available to the root zone...

 

when i tried the "layer" method i was sadly disappointed with the results as compared to K.I.S.S soil results...

 

the quantity of final product tends to suffer with organic soils.. however the quality is far superior in my humble opinion.

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the longer you age your soil, the less you have to worry about hot spots.

Dlo, awesome. I've never seen that in a store but I dont go to stores anymore.  Where did you pick it up?  It costs me 250 to make 80 gallons of super soil, so roughly the same cost as what you paid for the bag ready to use.  Nice!  It sure is a lot of work to mix all this stuff up and store it in barrels to cook.

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Dlo,,i know that out west some folks are selling Subcool like soils in bags but i don't think he's selling it pre-bagged,at least he's not hawking it online...he gives seminars on growing and supersoil is one of the topics.he gives the recipe out and talks about how to use it...it's kind of a "how to" video on line..i used his new version of the recipe for this grow,not my own version.

   thanks Zap for putting me in my place..lol..or should i say the right place. anyway i've heard that i should expect lower yields when going organic but the quality is supposed to make up for it..Grassmatch thanks for the info on the foliar feeding..boosting the terpenes is why i'm trying something new.the thc levels of my hempy grows were up there with the best of other growers but it lacked the aromas they were getting...and don't we all love stinky buds..lol..

   the thing i'm most worried about are the bad bugs...i've grown in soil before and it was always a challenge keeping the bugs out of my grows..thats one of the things i liked so much about the perlite and vermitulite deal,the bugs just didn't like it...now i've got bugs in my soil and i'm supposed to me happy about it...lol..bp

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Dlo,,i know that out west some folks are selling Subcool like soils in bags but i don't think he's selling it pre-bagged,at least he's not hawking it online...he gives seminars on growing and supersoil is one of the topics.he gives the recipe out and talks about how to use it...it's kind of a "how to" video on line..i used his new version of the recipe for this grow,not my own version.

   thanks Zap for putting me in my place..lol..or should i say the right place. anyway i've heard that i should expect lower yields when going organic but the quality is supposed to make up for it..Grassmatch thanks for the info on the foliar feeding..boosting the terpenes is why i'm trying something new.the thc levels of my hempy grows were up there with the best of other growers but it lacked the aromas they were getting...and don't we all love stinky buds..lol..

   the thing i'm most worried about are the bad bugs...i've grown in soil before and it was always a challenge keeping the bugs out of my grows..thats one of the things i liked so much about the perlite and vermitulite deal,the bugs just didn't like it...now i've got bugs in my soil and i'm supposed to me happy about it...lol..bp

love those bugs. amazon sells a bo of 500? yellow sticky strips, a good deal. my bo lasts for years. this will help identify your pests. some are just nasty vile creatures that die in your stickiness and pop when you burn them, others are devouring the tender roots of your precious clones retarding there growth, and still others are actually eating some of those bad ones. spring ants are interesting. they come in like an army and hunt for aphids. the ants love their sweet pee so much they farm the aphid larvae and fiercely protect them from danger. They rotate and fuss with them non stop. Guard ants will move an entire colony from one plant pot to another to avoid you or your fuss. The ants are of little trouble but signal the onset of an aphid issue. a quick soil dunk in a neem mix will stop that one and the flying ants will get caught up in your stickies.

 

Other mj pest have their own agendas and a fascinating life of their own. I've found it much more pleasing to manage them rather than aim to eradicate. The bulk of them are positive, prodcing tons(well, maybe not tons)of insect frass, dead shells, and eating other out of control populations. gnats are easy to get rid of if you pay attention to each plant each day, you'll see the whole brood caught up in one sticky. I used to c02 my room yearly to kill every thing in there, but stopped when I went organic with no regrets.

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there are downsides to subcools "layering" method

 

as i researched subcools system and a few other "super" soils that require layering including the rev's system and i found there is one constant truth...

 

cannabis plant's roots do not enjoy "hot spots"

 

they (arguably) seem to prefer a consistent base soil that has everything they need mixed consistently within the primary base soil so that is available to the root zone...

 

when i tried the "layer" method i was sadly disappointed with the results as compared to K.I.S.S soil results...

 

the quantity of final product tends to suffer with organic soils.. however the quality is far superior in my humble opinion.

Mibrain..after reading your eariler post on K.I.S.S. i was going to do a side by side grow to compare the two..the only issue i had was that you use ProMix vs. True Oranics brand soil in the Subcool mix and i didn't want to buy both.alot of the other ingredients were the same...with subcools recipe you can adjust the amount of soil you get by just doing smaller batches(bags) vs. starting with a bale of promix,both would be alot for what i do.that and the fact that SC's has bat guano in it and thought kiss wouldn't be a true water only formula and i'd have to add nitrogen at some point...bp

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Mibrain..after reading your eariler post on K.I.S.S. i was going to do a side by side grow to compare the two..the only issue i had was that you use ProMix vs. True Oranics brand soil in the Subcool mix and i didn't want to buy both.alot of the other ingredients were the same...with subcools recipe you can adjust the amount of soil you get by just doing smaller batches(bags) vs. starting with a bale of promix,both would be alot for what i do.that and the fact that SC's has bat guano in it and thought kiss wouldn't be a true water only formula and i'd have to add nitrogen at some point...bp

understandable..

fyi... you can use any soil for the base that you choose.. i use promix.. but i have been considering a change because of the 100 mile rule...

 

i felt the same way 2 years ago when i was researching organic "water only" soil..

 

they are close to similar but understand KISS is "add it and forget it" style ingredients

 

to date... nearly 2 years into my transformation to KISS soil i can honestly attest to one truth..

 

the plants seem to love enriched soil that is ready for them to explode.

 

all i do is water...

 

nothing but pure R/O water when needed.

 

i have seen bigger results in the same size containers but i have never seen anything close to the quality.

 

i use 10 gallon pots to flower because the extra couple gallons helps to make sure the plants have everything they need to make it to maturity....

 

i don't want to add anything.

 

its a pain to have to do..

 

once i mix my KISS soil with my electric cement mixer... thats it.. its over... all i do is add water.

 

pure R/O water...

 

is it "cal mag" deficient?

 

possibly... but the girls love the pure water and the simplicity that does not add anything after they are transplanted... kinda like nature... you are where you are... in the plant kingdom..

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I've 'bombed' a sealed room with C02 by releasing an entire 20# tank.  It didn't do anything to the bugs.

why would it? You must first figure the cubic feet of the room, the cubic feet capability of the tank, and the seal quality of the room. Otherwise you may have just raised the c02 to a comfortable plant need of 1500ppm, hardly enough to kill a mite or gnat.

They start dying at around 8000ppm and by the time 10kppm is on the very largest of them are going legs up. Within an hour everything small breathing oxygen is dead, of course, because the c02 displaces the oxygen. its logical with no voodoo involved. Not enough air, and things die. c02 does not poison them at all, only the lack of oxygen.

 

Note that the epa says you can withstand 10kppm for an allotted mount of time. I can tell you that I would not agree to stand in it for more than 5 minutes for anything. Just long enough for me to turn on the emergency exhaust and evacuate the room to 15ooppm's for the plant win during lights on.

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Mibrain..after reading your eariler post on K.I.S.S. i was going to do a side by side grow to compare the two

 

i would love to see a side by side comparison in a journal..

 

seriously that would be awesome..

i only do one grow per year,for myself...but i've got all the mixin's to do a side by side,the only issue would be that i seldom do more than 1 of each plant.i do that for the variety..i could do a side by side and see if one strain or strains did better than another,,which flavor of promix do you suggest,,,i know they have two or three...bp

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i currently use promix HP for my base...

 

the HP stands for High Porosity.. which means they added 25% more perlite to help the overall soil aeration.

 

i am totally open to any suggestions to a better base alternative.

 

i am aware that it is peat moss based..from Canada.... a non renewable resource... that in itself makes me want to find a suitable replacement....

 

i have been interested in a better option for some time but have failed to be able to procure the time to effectively find and then ultimately recommend one...

 

an American made base soil would be way way better than anything else..

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Okay,  I did the calculation for you.

 

20#CO2* (453.592 grams co2/1# co2) * (1000mg/1g) = 9,071,840 mG CO2.

 

My room size is 3.6x2.7x2.1 Meters3 which equals 21.41 Meters3

9,071840mG CO2/21.41 Meters3 = 423719mG/Meters3 concentration.

PPMs= = (mg/m3 value )(24.45)/(molecular weight)
PPMs CO2 in my room = 423719mG/Meters3 *(22.4)/ (44.01grams/mol)

 this equals 215,662 PPM CO2.

This is under the assumption that CO2 behaves as an ideal gas and that my conditions are under STP which means 1ATM, 273 degrees K. 
Because we are operating at a higher temperature, it changes the gas law equation a bit but the end result is still in the upwards of 200,000 PPM

 

Given one tank lasts me 10-14 days, it is not unreasonable to say unleashing an entire tank in a room this size will bump the PPMs up to 215,000

 

Edited by garyfisher
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