Michigan Unemployment And Mmj

[Restorium2]

Sorry to hear about your family.  I know there are situations where good people can wind up in bad situations and actually need help but there are also thousands of fat ladies sitting in the casino smoking cigarettes every time welfare payday comes around and I resent being forced by my government to fund it. 

 

I'm far from the "ive got mine, screw you" person you think I am.  I guarantee I've done more for people I don't know than most on here.  But I stand by my assertion that the government is supposed to do a very limited number of things.  Redistributing wealth isn't on the list.  That's what churches and charities are for. 

Are you always looking for excuses for your selfishness all around you like you do when you are at the casino wasting your money? You seem to be there every welfare payday if I'm to take you serious. How do you spot a fat lady that's a welfare slob and not just a regular fat lady?

[Restorium2]

Redistributing wealth isn't on the list.

 

Well it is on a lot of folks lists. Just look at the rich getting richer as the poor getting poorer. The rich are redistributing wealth into their pockets. We are just trying to stop the redistribution of wealth that the Republicans are working so hard at. Pretty ironic that the selfish conservatives are accusing us of doing what they are doing like wild dogs.

[nsmn8r]

Are you always looking for excuses for your selfishness all around you like you do when you are at the casino wasting your money? You seem to be there every welfare payday if I'm to take you serious. How do you spot a fat lady that's a welfare slob and not just a regular fat lady?

 

I'm using that as an example because it just came up in a conversation I had with a friend that works at gun lake casino.  Apparently it's common knowledge that the day after welfare payday is the busiest.  Another example of waste that came up in the same conversation is the guy that buys groceries for .50 on the dollar by trading cash for bridge cards. 

 

By the way, anyone have any idea how much of each dollar collected goes to the needy (whether or not they are scamming) and how much is used up by the machine before it gets to the people?

 

And if I want to waste my money at the casino or on hookers and blow it's my right. I earned it. It's none of your business or the government's. 

Now if it was money you gave me or loaned me, then you might have a say in how I use it.  Can't you see where this leads? 

[nsmn8r]

Redistributing wealth isn't on the list.

 

Well it is on a lot of folks lists. Just look at the rich getting richer as the poor getting poorer. The rich are redistributing wealth into their pockets. We are just trying to stop the redistribution of wealth that the Republicans are working so hard at. Pretty ironic that the selfish conservatives are accusing us of doing what they are doing like wild dogs.

 

I agree 100%.  The republicans are just as bad as you dems.  Anyone voting for either party is voting for corruption.  What you view as the lesser of two evils is still evil. 

[Restorium2]

I'm using that as an example because it just came up in a conversation I had with a friend that works at gun lake casino.  Apparently it's common knowledge that the day after welfare payday is the busiest.  Another example of waste that came up in the same conversation is the guy that buys groceries for .50 on the dollar by trading cash for bridge cards. 

 

By the way, anyone have any idea how much of each dollar collected goes to the needy (whether or not they are scamming) and how much is used up by the machine before it gets to the people?

 

And if I want to waste my money at the casino or on hookers and blow it's my right. I earned it. It's none of your business or the government's. 

Now if it was money you gave me or loaned me, then you might have a say in how I use it.  Can't you see where this leads? 

So you are using second hand hearsay to slam these fat ladies. Gotcha. 

 

Better watch your arse wasting all that money at the casino. I don't go there because I need to save it in case something bad happens to me. 

 

You say it's none of anyone's business what someone does with their money?

 

Hypocrit much? 

 

You just flip flopped and double standarded all over this thread. That is a trademark of nosey and selfish conservatives. You have become someone that is very hard for you to explain.

[YesMichigan]

Well that is clueless. 

 

Nothing like an insult to really get conversation going. It illustrates you respect the person you're speaking to and you're ready for thought-expanding discourse.

 

My family was all dead by the time I was 27 and I was disabled at age 31.  I should have chosen a better family? heh.  My friends "helped" but are friends supposed to support you?  Or even able to? How about everyone pitch in a few bucks and help everyone out?

 

Who determines how many bucks get pitched in and then who needs them? Reminds me of the girl who needed braces in the socialist town from "Atlas Shrugged". Who is most in need and most deserving of assistance? Who should give more or less? That is a decision every society leaves to the people who control the people with guns. The USA is no different.

 

This is about having a strong society. We can choose the basis for how our society works.  Everyone helping everyone is a much better society to live in.  I feel sorry for those that see no use in community and are laser focused on only individualism. 

 

Your pity isn't needed. Many of us focused on individualism celebrate your individuality, even if you want to use your uniqueness to try and make everyone the same. Individualists aren't your enemy. Your enemies are the collectivists like you who envision a different "utopia". You will your entire life seeing the world from behind your eyes. You can embrace community and society all you want but your perspective will still be your own. We come in and we go out alone. We associate with others but we are not bovine in our interdependence. The strength of the individual is what made America the center of the world for new thought and ideas. That was lost and I blame collectivism.

 

 Government(community leadership) is merely there to oversee and implement the publics will and satisfy an acceptable level of societal functions from which we all benefit.

 

Not sure where this happens but it sounds like a goal that is not being achieved in America but we agree it sounds okay.

 

 Without support programs and oversight, society collapses.  The tragedy of commons become robust and structures deteriorate, break down and no one lives in a tolerable environment.

 

That is a leap in logic and far outside of what a person can predict. I would call it fear-tactics in order to keep the "less capable" from trying to exit social programs. I contend the support programs act as a noose in many communities but welfare in all of its forms is critical to me and I advocate using resources more effectively to provide REAL help for people and REAL involvement, not just a check in the mail and GOOD LUCK!! Help when you can - there is enough waste in the budget that the least empowered of our society shouldn't carry any of the deficit.

 

 You tell people no support when destitute,... people will lie, cheat and steal to feed their children.  It is natural.  Knowing it is natural, as a society, we provide a safety net of support to keep society from crumbling so we can maintain a better life for everyone.

 

The safety net is not a good one but I feel you. People who complain about their taxes and the like I remind them "You would be running over poor or old people at every intersection if they weren't assisted." The ardently selfish just need to know how their spent money made THEIR life better. You do a good job spelling out the benefits. I like your Liberal side. It's the Democrat in you that I disagree with.

 

I don't know,.... I find selfish attitudes and the overbearance of "ive got mine,  screw you" to be people I do not want in my society.  We are in this together like it or not.

 

"people I do not want in my society." followed with "We are in this together like it or not." So they have to follow your plan or you want them out of your society? If "WE are in this together like it or not" don't you have to follow their plan just as much as they are required to follow yours?  This is where I, as an Independent or an "Individualist", breaks from your agenda of social change and conscience because both "factions" preach "Work together" while calling the other side evil and "impossible to work with". Leads a free-thinker to come to the conclusion both parties thrive on the gridlock and wink at each other when they leave the office at night.

[YesMichigan]

So you are using second hand hearsay to slam these fat ladies. Gotcha. 

 

Better watch your arse wasting all that money at the casino. I don't go there because I need to save it in case something bad happens to me. 

 

You say it's none of anyone's business what someone does with their money?

 

Hypocrit much? 

 

You just flip flopped and double standarded all over this thread. That is a trademark of nosey and selfish conservatives. You have become someone that is very hard for you to explain.

 

You lost his analogy. The person at the casino was wasting HIS and YOUR money. It wasn't a hypocritical statement just because you aren't able to follow.

 

There are no "fat ladies" - by your pedantic analysis of his story we are to believe you think 100% of the people receiving social assistance are 100% legitimate, there is no waste in the program and people who claim there is are just selfish Republicans who want poor people to die?

[Restorium2]

You lost his analogy. The person at the casino was wasting HIS and YOUR money. It wasn't a hypocritical statement just because you aren't able to follow.

 

There are no "fat ladies" - by your pedantic analysis of his story we are to believe you think 100% of the people receiving social assistance are 100% legitimate, there is no waste in the program and people who claim there is are just selfish Republicans who want poor people to die?

No. The analogy was that he's extremely worried about someone spending their money, the fat lady, who he doesn't even know. Yet it's no one's business what he's doing with his money. Glad to explain it ...

[nsmn8r]

No. The analogy was that he's extremely worried about someone spending their money, the fat lady, who he doesn't even know. Yet it's no one's business what he's doing with his money. Glad to explain it ...

No I'm extremely worried about how someone else is spending MY money.

 

I could throw some insults back but I won't.

[nsmn8r]

Thanks YesMichigan. I was starting to think I'm the only Libertarian on this board.

[+Malamute]

"I've got mine, screw you" refers to those who do not wish to participate in society. The society still is influenced and they still benefit from society thought they refuse to believe so.  They want the benefits of society without the personal responsibility. 

 

 

 Running through,... can address more later.

 

add:  I should say,... they have benefitted from society their whole lives as well,.. and do not wish to pay back into it as well.

 

 Think "joe the plumber".

 

;-)

[YesMichigan]

Thanks YesMichigan. I was starting to think I'm the only Libertarian on this board.

 

Easy champ, I am NOT a Libertarian. I am an Independent. Too many whacked out Libertarians who still think they are Democrats or Republicans for my taste.

 

Vote for people not parties. You have no point of view if you sell your agenda to a party. Your opinion is theirs the moment you vote straight ticket. That's fine for some people and I support their right to not think about it more than that.

[nsmn8r]

Easy champ, I am NOT a Libertarian. I am an Independent. Too many whacked out Libertarians who still think they are Democrats or Republicans for my taste.

 

Vote for people not parties. You have no point of view if you sell your agenda to a party. Your opinion is theirs the moment you vote straight ticket. That's fine for some people and I support their right to not think about it more than that.

 

I agree with you but it seems that with no party we have no voice.  You may not be a Libertarian but you talk one and I appreciate it.

[YesMichigan]

"I've got mine, screw you" refers to those who do not wish to participate in society. The society still is influenced and they still benefit from society thought they refuse to believe so.  They want the benefits of society without the personal responsibility. 

 

 

 Running through,... can address more later.

 

add:  I should say,... they have benefitted from society their whole lives as well,.. and do not wish to pay back into it as well.

 

 Think "joe the plumber".

 

;-)

 

I had no problem with your take there and I understand it and even agree. I highlighted that you don't want them in "your society".

 

They have paid what the people with guns (government) demanded that they pay. If not they went to prison or paid more money to hire a lawyer and get out of it or whatever. Regardless they have the same rights as you. They could start bonfires in their backyard with stacks of 100's and I'd support them - if you broke their privacy fence to try and "save" the money and redistribute it I would advocate police intervention to stop your trespassing.

 

People can do what they want with what is theirs. I know we disagree on that. The "shame" that I see is that the "ultra-rich" (Democrats AND Republicans) have to wait for the government to come and tell them how to help people. Really? Titans of industry can't figure out how to take 50k out of their pocket and open a soup kitchen? Why do Buffett and Gates hoard their riches?

[nsmn8r]

"I've got mine, screw you" refers to those who do not wish to participate in society. The society still is influenced and they still benefit from society thought they refuse to believe so.  They want the benefits of society without the personal responsibility. 

 

 

 Running through,... can address more later.

 

add:  I should say,... they have benefitted from society their whole lives as well,.. and do not wish to pay back into it as well.

 

 Think "joe the plumber".

 

;-)

 

I agree that everyone should participate in society and we  all benefit when we do.  I just think we should do it because we want to not because the government forces us.

[nsmn8r]

I agree with you but it seems that with no party we have no voice.  You may not be a Libertarian but you talk one and I appreciate it.

Or maybe I don't know what a Libertarian is?  I liked your word "Free Thinking".  I thought the two were synonymous but I'm new to politics. 

[+Malamute]

Dam. You guys are posting too fast I am trying to watch a stupid movie. :-)

 

 

Community/society/collectivism breeds stability. As a society, we decided we want a certain degree of stability in our lives.  Consistant water supply, roads, bridges, electric grids, sidewalks, traffic lights, garbage removal,  building projects, protection, oversight, helping hands etc.

 

 

 btw, other topic, Welfare checks do not go out the same days as Social Secuirty and disability checks. What your moron friend is seeing is people spending their SOCIAL SECURITY checks at the first of the month.  It is their money and they invested it themselves so they can receive it and spend it anyway they see fit without your bigoted attitudes judging them. (Fat, Ugly, Smoking, Women) Any other predispositions you may have about welfare? Welfare is mostly children, elderly and disabled by like some 75%+ number.

[+Malamute]

Libertarian is a philosohy that is great to discuss, and completely doesn't work in reality.

[YesMichigan]

Or maybe I don't know what a Libertarian is?  I liked your word "Free Thinking".  I thought the two were synonymous but I'm new to politics. 

 

Libertarians don't know what they are. Study the party and its politics for awhile and you won't want people labeling you one more than likely. (Read that Chad? Change the most popular thread title to INDEPENDENTS rule D's and R's drool, please). I'll admit I won't get angry if called a Libertarian - call me a Republican or a Democrat and we are going to have a serious discussion so that I can explain how I am neither of those things.

 

There are misguided people who were intentionally misled by the Tea Party to thinking Libertarians are Republicans. Watch out for those people and set them straight every chance you get. One of my best friends hit me with that last week and I aspirated.

[YesMichigan]

Libertarian is a philosohy that is great to discuss, and completely doesn't work in reality.

 

You and your unsupported conjecture.

 

Democracy is a philosophy that is great to discuss and completely doesn't work in reality.

 

Communism is a philosophy that is great to discuss and completely doesn't work in reality.

 

Reality is a philosophy that is great to discuss and completely doesn't work in reality.

 

The sky is purple and the ocean is red you just don't see it like I do.

[+Malamute]

If government  doesn't tell people to pay their fair share, no one will. 

 

Tragedy of the commons and the prisoners dilemma are just 2 quick basic issues that make libertarianism unfeasible and why we need items for the public good.  We are more selfish as individuals than we are as a society.  Society can make the sum of its parts better and stronger.

[+Malamute]

You and your unsupported conjecture.

 

Democracy is a philosophy that is great to discuss and completely doesn't work in reality.

 

Communism is a philosophy that is great to discuss and completely doesn't work in reality.

 

Reality is a philosophy that is great to discuss and completely doesn't work in reality.

 

The sky is purple and the ocean is red you just don't see it like I do.

 

 

 I have addressed these issues with you before and you always avoid discussing the specifics of it.

 

Generalized nonsense and false equivalency isn't working for you on this.

[+Malamute]

Also, Redistribution of wealth is a MUST in any Free market capitalistic society.  Without it, ONE person ends up with everything. It is the final game of capitalism if done properly. Redistribution helps bring a balance to the phenomenon that occurs in capitalism.  Capitalism in its pure form means there is only ONE winner, and it wont be you.

[+Malamute]

This is why we need a WELL REGULATED market with a Progressive tax structure.

[nsmn8r]

If government  doesn't tell people to pay their fair share, no one will. 

 

Tragedy of the commons and the prisoners dilemma are just 2 quick basic issues that make libertarianism unfeasible and why we need items for the public good.  We are more selfish as individuals than we are as a society.  Society can make the sum of its parts better and stronger.

 

That's a pretty cynical view of society.  I think exactly the opposite is true or there wouldn't be so many commercials on showing starving African kids and abused puppies.

 

People's heart strings, and in turn their purse strings, are easily played. 

 

I'll have to google Tragedy of the commons and prisoner's dilemma.

 

Thanks for the conversation. I appreciate you sharing your point of view.