New & Tons To Learn

[Blkwlf]

Hey everyone; I just started with this in the spring as a possible partial solution to all the heavy meds I've been having to take for a bone disease I was born with which became active again 20 yrs ago. The pain meds cause so many side effects I have to take more meds just for those. Everyone here seems to genuinely want to help and it's great to actually be able to discuss troubles and triumphs with people close to home. About to begin my first harvest and think I may have allowed a Pinapple Express and Apricot Cush to go too long. I was given the harvest dates fron the guys I got the plants from but they were already mature and I had no idea when they'd been cloned, germinated or first planted let alone how long in veg. etc. My pineapple Express began shedding it's fan leaves 3 weeks ago and the tiny bud leaves have just begun to curl and dry out. My Apricot Cush started shedding it's fan leaves about a weeks ago. I read online that these issues could also be from too high humidity plus I don't have any fans on them yet. I'm thinking they're past their harvest dates and plan to pull them tomarrow even though the harvest dates I was given were after July 13th. I did get some good clones from them and have been tracking growth and trimming so they'll looking real good. I know now that the ones I got should have been trimmed and topped because they were a bit scruffy when I got them. I'm so very happy to have found this web site and to have read many of the posts from the guy who created Apricot Cush. I hope I can do him proud with the babies I've started. Thank you for the help I've already received. I'm looking forward to learning and growing ( in all ways ) with all of you.

[t-pain]

the only problems you run into when running a plant "too long" is hermies/seeds or budrot.

 

if you dont have either of those problems, you are going to have a VERY STRONG body high with the resulting plant.

 

forget harvest dates anyway. it all depends on plant growth. how do the trichromes look? cloudy/milky? not talking about the pistils being white or amber, but the actual colors of the crystals on the plant (use a magnifying glass / microscope to see it). there are guides on the net how to tell if its "ready", with example images of microscope pictures showing the colors...

 

welcome to the site, ask lots of questions, never overwater/overfeed you can always underfeed.

[GregS]

Clean it up and enjoy! There is no reason to expect there is anything wrong with it. It is the type of effects that occur at different stages of ripening that are typically affected, but not necessarily for the worst. It is considered that weed that is well ripened has a more mellow, soothing, effect than does underripe bud. Sounds to me that you're doing great.

 

It's alll good.

[GrowGoddess]

I wouldn't worry much about the exact dates for finishing. Different phenotypes from the same strain can easily vary by 2 weeks.

 

When I grow a new strain that I am not familiar with, I usually harvest when there is a bout 80% red hairs on the buds.

 

My patients have had most success using concentrated cannabis oil (RSO) for reducing the need for their pain meds, which has also reduced their need for the additional meds.

 

There is a lot of information on this website regarding concentrates.

 

Good luck to you!

 

One day I would like to try Pineapple Express. I have seen the movie, very funny! LOL

[suneday11]

Tricloud!!! The apricot cush is the bomb!

 

And welcome!!!

Edited July 5, 2015 by suneday11

[Hydraulic Jack]

Tricloud!!! The apricot cush is the bomb!

 

And welcome!!!

I can hardly wait.....I have 6 in the seedling stage...HJ

[imiubu]

Hey everyone; I just started with this in the spring as a possible partial solution to all the heavy meds I've been having to take for a bone disease I was born with which became active again 20 yrs ago. The pain meds cause so many side effects I have to take more meds just for those. Everyone here seems to genuinely want to help and it's great to actually be able to discuss troubles and triumphs with people close to home. About to begin my first harvest and think I may have allowed a Pinapple Express and Apricot Cush to go too long. I was given the harvest dates fron the guys I got the plants from but they were already mature and I had no idea when they'd been cloned, germinated or first planted let alone how long in veg. etc. My pineapple Express began shedding it's fan leaves 3 weeks ago and the tiny bud leaves have just begun to curl and dry out. My Apricot Cush started shedding it's fan leaves about a weeks ago. I read online that these issues could also be from too high humidity plus I don't have any fans on them yet. I'm thinking they're past their harvest dates and plan to pull them tomarrow even though the harvest dates I was given were after July 13th. I did get some good clones from them and have been tracking growth and trimming so they'll looking real good. I know now that the ones I got should have been trimmed and topped because they were a bit scruffy when I got them. I'm so very happy to have found this web site and to have read many of the posts from the guy who created Apricot Cush. I hope I can do him proud with the babies I've started. Thank you for the help I've already received. I'm looking forward to learning and growing ( in all ways ) with all of you.

 

I'm out of 'likes' lol.

 

Welcome to the site! 

 

I have very little experience with growing, so I won't attempt giving advise

One thing that did help me was a loupe.  You can see those trichomes (and pests) up close and personal.

 

Sounds like you are well on your way and 2 great strains imho.

 

Grow on!

Edited July 5, 2015 by imiubu

[Blkwlf]

Sorry, I can't seem to get my "quote" working right. Computer needs serious clean. T-Pain: I'm definately going to have to look up those sites. I tried a magnifying glass but it wasn't strong enough only 4x. Guy I got plants from coming over today to check their readiness and help me through my first real trim. I'm definatetly watching my watering and feeding even using feeling weight of soil/bags to help as a guide and I'm sure I'll have a lot more questions. :-)

 

GregS: That's heartening news. I'm now thinking that the leaves dropping may be due to too much humity and no fans so the fan leaves can't sweat, but heard that some strains will start dropping fan leaves close to end of budding. I guess I'll find out.

 

GrowGoddess: I've been researching going to hash/oils and will be learning first hand how it's done using BHO real soon. My grow's still small, just my own and my husband has a grow for his patients so I'm trying to figure out best way to store the good trim and smaller buds for hash/oil until we have more at one time. Still trying to get the growing part down pat. I know my best chance for it helping me is in oils since I know I can't smoke it though thinking of trying a vapoizor. As for the Pineapple Express, Hubby had an outdoor plant lose it's top in a storm so I took a bunch of clones off it and have 20 babies started so I'll have a lot coming up.

I'm using the dates more as guides but I think it's better to know the history of a plant you're putting in bud which I'll have on the next harvest.

 

Imiubu: This first harvest should be pretty decent and will consist of Pineapple Express, Apricot Cush, OG18, LSD, Orange Kush, Kosher Kush and Critical Kush I've been researching strains for what I want to grow and what I want to keep. So many strain, So little time.

 

Thank you all very much, you've been very helpful and encouraging. Hubby and I plan joining the MMMA in a few months and hope to actually meet some of you eventually. Hubby's been growing a bit longer but not at the level ( quality ) that we've recently decided to grow and neither of us have tried oils but plan to soon.

 

[trichcycler]

Jorge Cervantes Grow Bible is the best material I've found to follow

for an issue free experience in the cannabis garden. Its free to download

 on the net now, but I recommend the purchase of the glossy pages table book.

 

have fun, be safe

[t-pain]

20 babies plus clones huh? Remember to stay under your plant limits................

[GregS]

Many, if not all, plants will have their leaves yellow and drop off. We are, after all, bluffing them to convince them that it's fall, and they respond by ripening, drawing the nutrients from the green leaves to feed other parts of the plant, in this case the flowers, which would be seeds if they had germinated, as do some other plants at the end of their life cycle. Think October. Gourds, corn, and squash put their dying energy to use ripening the seeds too.

Edited July 5, 2015 by GregS

[trichcycler]

I was given the harvest dates fron the guys I got the plants from but they were already mature and I had no idea when they'd been cloned, germinated or first planted let alone how long in veg. etc. I'm thinking they're past their harvest dates

The age of the clone or vegged plant has no bearing on the finish date of the plant. Cannabis can be planted from seed directly into the flowering stage for instance, and still have a smooth 60 ish day finish. You could vegetate a cannabis plant for years without flowering it, and the finish date will still be within range of breeder rec time, assuming grow room parameters are the same.  Keep in mind a reputable breeder has a dialed in room suffering no outside threats, like high/low temps, humidity, c02 depletion, etc.  Plants grow to their weakest resource, and could be a slower or less fruitful as each parameter is suffered. Giving them all they need from day one is the fast track to perfect harvests.

 

my lsd, kosher, critical always finish within 55-70 days from the day I change the light cycle to 12/12, like the remainder of my harem. I could cut any of them at 50, or at 70 and still have viable medical value. I enjoy a 60 day finish mostly, with these.

 

 

happy gardening!

Edited July 5, 2015 by grassmatch

[Blkwlf]

Grassmatch: We recently got that book, and in hard copy, we too prefer actual books. I know clone, germination, etc. doesn't mean a whole lot in the end but it does help to know the plant's history, how well it's been doing in veg, nutrients given, soil used and what light cycle they were under prior to putting in to flower, etc. I guess I stressed dates too much instead of "knowing" the plant.. :-) T-Pain: Yes, I'm keeping track of my counts. My husband is a caregiver w/ 5 patients plus myself and anymore I may pick up but I've kept very close eye on our numbers but thank you for looking out. Other's may not be as diligent. Grassmatch, you've been so very helpful from the clones to this. I greatly appreciate the support I've found here. I'll keep that 60 day average in mind for those strains. I see I need to amp up a few of my tools. My bug problem's been very minimal but I know I have an issue with humidity and need to add a few dehumidifyers. GregS: That was my thought as well. I figured they were just doing what I'm starting to do with those which haven't started dropping their fan leaves yet. I do have a lot of farming history, especially tomatoes, just not as much indoor which creates it's own unique issues. Hubby is more versed in the seeding, germinating, tricombe maturity, etc. than myself and is helping some but it never hurts to do my own research, ask my own questions or make my own mistakes. As far as cloning is concerned, I picked that up and did very well quickly to the point that I really did have to stop and give the cloner a rest due to being close to our limit. Thank you all again and Greener Pastures to you all!!!!

[trichcycler]

You are welcome, and thank you for the kind words. You have The book, now I know you'll do fine! 

 

 

enjoy!

[Blkwlf]

Maybe I should have mentioned this. Even though my husband's a Caregiver and I'm a Patient ( separeate from my husband ) my husband's Never smoked Marijuana and I only smoked it a couple times over 20 years ago without any desirable effects ( probably not very good weed ). Due to many reconstructive surgeries on my hands due to a very rare bone disease and industrial chemical burns to my lungs, smoking isn''t the best delivery system for me even though I am hoping to reduce and/or replace some of my pain meds and meds I take for side effects of the pain meds. I'm definately going to be looking for a vaporizor which can handle bud, hash or oil until we get experienced in making the oils ourselves. Looking into making butter too but there are sooooo many different methods of doing this it's difficult to know which is best besides using actual BHO, etc. oils mixed with softened butter ( something we're not set up to make yet ). Would love to attend some of the local compassion club meetings and plan on joining MMMA within the next month. Because of our personal ignorance/inexperience with using marijuana we depend on feedback from patients and information regarding various strains online until I start experimenting with the strains we have myself. I understand we're not the "typical" growers but we're intent on providing quality product for my own benefit as well as that of our patients. As always, ANY feedback good or bad is very welcome.

[trichcycler]

I'm not sure there is a "best" procedure for extracting cannabis oil. It should be safe of course, and complete removal is paramount if using any petroleum type solvents. fumes are always a consideration, and open air evaporation can be dangerous, not environmentally friendly either. I suggest an edible approach first. Ancients used olive oil and no heat. Any cooking oil will extract from cannabis, and low temps below boiling are better than high temps.  The best edible extraction I've done for eating used a percolator coffee pot. I filled the basket with coarsely ground buds added water and cream to the pot and brewed it. Absolutely awesome and about the only way I swallow cannabis ediblest now.

 

A simple quick wash with alcohol produces a fine product. I would use 97% or 99% isopropyl alcohol, a large mason jar, bit of screen, much ground buds. I use a large flour grinder to prepare mine. I fill the jar with the bud and top it with alcohol. Grain alcohol is also a fine option, but it wont evaporate as quickly as isopropyl alcohol.

I cap and screw tight and shake for a minute or two. I replace the lid with a fitted screen and screw the cap over it to secure. After the alcohol is poured off of the bud into a glass dish I usually set it outside out of the sun. The alcohol will evaporate leaving a fine oil suitable for vaporizing, smoking, or ingesting when the alcohol is completely removed, some non flame heat will expedite the evaporation.

I'd avoid butane until I could afford  closed loop system. A good one will facilitate the complete process sealed inside including reclaiming the solvent for later use.

 

stay safe

[Wild Bill]

Try making a gylcerite or as  it's commonly called a glycerin tincture. I also have lung problems and am becoming increasingly more fond of these. They're easy to add to other liquids like carbonated beverages and easy to regulate dosage by just sipping until you feel the effect you're looking for.

 

Most recently I've been using 1 oz. of cannabis powdered in a coffee grinder left to soak in 8 oz. of vegetable gylcerin and 2 oz. of Everclear. The addition of the alcohol speeds up the process of dissolving the resins and cuts out the need to heat it. Just let it soak for a week or so in a dark place, shaking several times a day.

[t-pain]

i wonder if you can put the mix in a vacuum chamber? will the low pressure extract things from the plant material? not sure how alcohol or oil behave in a vacuum chamber though.

[Blkwlf]

Grassmatch: Sry for my late reply to your post. My DR. sends me to hospital for a few days once a year with 24 hr notice for bone scans, blood tests, etc., etc. I always know it's coming but never exactly when ( always between June-Aug. ) Of course drug tests, liver tests etc., etc., are also a part of this. I have to be in hospital due to the extent of time required to run both full body and individual bone x-rays and bone scans. I had considered the butter method for my first try at edibles but am now considering trying the ways you mentioned. Wild Bill: it does seem as if the methods mentioned by GRassmatch and yourself would be easier to control dosage as well as faster reaction times than simply making the butter although I still want to attempt that as well. I agree that I should stay away from some of the more volatile methods even though my now empty horsebarn would work well considering gthe ventilation, etc. The main danger there of course is all of the exposed wood the stalls are made of which makes fire a danger. We also have a newer pole barn which is all metal except the wood structure and does have a concrete floor with tons of ventilation. Still, I think I'll stay away from that at the moment and stick to the methods both Grassmatch and Wild Bill have suggested. Of course I'll want to provide the oils to my husband's patients as well as any of my future ones but think I should learn to do smaller batches for myself first and become better educated overall.

Due to my personal experience using my home grown herbs for cooking such as peppermint, sage and other herbs, I already knew that the temperature had to be kept low, especially with butter since I don't want the oils fats and protiens separating. Once they separate, there's no way to "reconstitute" them properly. As for other oils such as Olive, Coconut, Peanut, etc., they too will separate and become watery like margerine if cooked at high temperature.

I never considered the use of alcohol though. I wouldn't use grain alcohols since my current pain meds don't mix well with ANY alcoholic beverages.

T-Pain: Regarding the vacuum chamber, I guess it would depend on the system. Some heat seems to be required for the oils from the buds to be expelled from everything I've read so far and I'm not sure how well th alcohol would evaporate in that environment. I've considered one of those bubble hash machines but would rather use the oils myself and, from my limited research, haven't found as much desire for the hash verses bud or oils. It seems to me, at this point in my limited experience, that oils are pushing out the demand for hash. Once again, thank you all very much for your input and suggestions. I'll definately let you know how it turns out as I cure my 1st harvest and get into my 2nd. I've already learned quite a bit during my 1st harvest regarding plant maturity, trimming methods and various ways of curing. I'll be changing a few things with my 2nd. Your input is greatly appreciated! BlkWlf

[trichcycler]

I've never seen olive, coconut or peanut oil separate, or cannabis oil coming out of its solution. Once infused these oils will heat, cool, heat, cool, over and over.

 

I use no heat when I make concentrates. no heat for the extraction, and no heat for the evaporation. nbutane evaporates at room temperature for thought.

[Wild Bill]

I never considered the use of alcohol though. I wouldn't use grain alcohols since my current pain meds don't mix well with ANY alcoholic beverages.

 

I'm in the same boat as you when it comes to alcohol. Even one shot sipped over an hour makes me ill. (Can't smoke, can't drink, what a wonderful life.)

 

The amount of alcohol used in the glycerin extraction is very minimal when taken in the tincture. You can always heat it in a double boiler to remove the alcohol after you strain it too.

 

Butter/oil extractions work very well but they take longer to feel the effects. The advantage of tinctures is a more rapid onset. The quickest onset for me other than smoking is a glycerite in a carbonated beverage. The carbonation seems to speed up absorption, you feel the effects within minutes.

 

Lately I've been putting a tablespoon in a 16 oz bottle of plain carbonated water and sipping on it all evening. Sometimes I add few drops of sugar free root beer extract. I tried adding lemon juice but for some reason that causes a precipitate to form.

[trichcycler]

"I never considered the use of alcohol though. I wouldn't use grain alcohols since my current pain meds don't mix well with ANY alcoholic beverages."

 

got me thinking, if you're not confident that you are able to remove ALL of the solvent used in an extraction you should consider using ONLY edible solvents.

 

"now empty horsebarn would work well considering gthe ventilation, etc. The main danger there of course is all of the exposed wood the stalls are made of which makes fire a danger. We also have a newer pole barn which is all metal except the wood structure and does have a concrete floor with tons of ventilation"

 

The flammable items in your are will have little bearing on the flashed explosion evaporated solvent will cause. Doing this indoors, regardless of fans and flammables is a bad idea. any spark, metal chip on the floor, electrical outlet, etc can set the explosion. The damage is done in the explosion, not typically the fire that could ensue. Even in a steel barn a butane explosion could kill you. food stuff solvents are safer. I want you and yours to live another hundred years, be safe!

[Blkwlf]

Grassmatch: When I mentioned separation of oils, I wasn't refering to the separation of the oils extracted from the cannabis separating from the oils used.

What I meant by "separate" such as butter does when heated with the oils and fats never again being "whole" again once cooled. It never has the same consistancy it had prior to heating. Vegetable oils go through other types of changes if heated to too high a temperature, kept at a high temp. too long or heated too fast. Scalding may occur, the oils can break down and become "watery" and lose their consistancy. Vegetable oils are more stable than butter which is best mixed at room temperature though you can't freeze them as can be done with butter and other dairy products. I plan to look up the methods you mentioned and pick up an older style coffee perculator w/strainer or something similar so I can experiment with the methods you and Wild Bill mentioned. I was definately not comfortable with using butane my first time out though am interested in how it's done and do have a barn with lot's of good ventilation in which to set up a butane system. Grassmatch: Could you recommend any web sites or somewhere on this site which would have directions as to how much oil, alcohol or other medium and how much marijuana is a good mixture? I realize I'll need to try different amounts and that, with some plants, it may take more or less but I need a starting point. Also, I know that some people will mix all of the trim plus buds from one harvest consisting of various strains. Since various harvests may consist of different strains it would seem difficult to produce a consistant product. Also, and please remember my ignorance in this mattter, wouldn't mixing the strains be inadvisable? I would think you'd want to use only one strain per batch unless purposely mixing 2-3 to achieve a desired effect. I realize I may have to use a variety of strains to achieve similar effects as my prescription medications depending on the time of day and purpose for using it which is why I didn't believe it wise to mix all of the buds to be used plus any trimmings from one harvest consisting of 3-5 strains together when making my oils. In an earlier post you mentioned using a coffee perculator which I also saw being used on a T.V. documentary to make the oils. In that case the cannibas and oil is heated slightly. Yet, in you above post you say you use No heat to make concentrates nor for extraction or evaporation. I have a TON of research yet to do. I've been reading posts throughout this web site but it could take me YEARS to get through everything. Though not a Compassion Club, I'm hoping to pick up patients much like myself who need it for chronic pain, severe nerve damage or disease, the effects of cancer treatment ( my husband went through that over 10 yrs ago when he was just 39 and strong ), PTSD, etc. so we're committed to producing quality products. We did take IMIUBU's suggestion and got a loupe which has 3 connected 5X magnifiers when combined elevate the magnification to either 10X or 15X. Using your advice regarding the hairs, we can clearly see the maturity much better than with the needle point, lighted 4X magnifier we had initially. Sorry I can't seem to get my "quote" working and my posts are so long. Again, I appreciate all your advice. Blkwlf

[trichcycler]

growgoddess has  a good blog here with everything you need to know.

 

you'll need to regulate your temperatures when using cooking oil. Some use added water as it keeps the temperature below 212 F while cooking.  I don't cook oils because I have no need to. In the past I had the equipment used to extract with no heat.

 

Pay attention to the trichomes, when they turn cloudy to amber you are ready to harvest. Some strains hairs turn colors early in flower, not always a good indicator.

If looking for good healing I suggest mixing strains before extractions. If you have excess to work with its very novel to use single strains too, even just to connect with the original profiles with flavor and smells.

 

peace

[Blkwlf]

GRassmatch: As always, you've been very helpful and I will check out growgoddess's blog. There's so much information on this web site alone that one can easily get lost. Thank for giving me some direction. I noticed during my first harvest that a couple of the plants probably should have been left under the lights for at least another week. Just the feel and look of the buds while trimming didn't seem right even though they were heavily haired. I did have 2 which I now know were more burned than naturally amber from the lights being too close. Experience is always the best teacher. The reason I didn't want to mix my strains when making the oils was because of my inexperience with cannabis let alone the oils and how they work. I didn't want mixting the strains to cloud my experience with each variety. An excess of trim isn't my problem at the moment though, while viewing what's available for sale on Craig's List, I can see that I tenmd to trim closer and leave less trim and stem on my buds than I've seen available online so my trim is going to contain more tiny full buds and leaves surrounding the buds than those I viewed. Our trimmed buds are about 90% bud with very few cut leaves or exterior stems from branch or leaves. Probably why it took me so long to do just 11 plants. As for flowering, I'm concentrating on keeping my lights away from the plants and making sure I don't pull any for harvest before they're ready. I also need to be a bit less OCD about trimming and believe I need to allow some to mature longer in vegetation before going to flower. As I told you before, I've been making sure to get clones from all of my real heathy plants and top strains. I think I'll keep some in vegetation so I can continue their lines. I'm learning as I go but, with the advise I've gotten from you and others here, I believe I'll become a much better grower. I can't thank you enough.