Ohioans Who Want To End The Drug War Should Vote Yes On Issue 3

[t-pain]

i'm standing in the mud fighting the prohibitionists and there you are standing with them, keeping marijuana illegal.

[t-pain]

What chance does a recreational marijuana user have?

thats the difference, i'm willing to find out.

 

what are you doing?

[Restorium2]

i'm standing in the mud fighting the prohibitionists and there you are standing with them, keeping marijuana illegal.

In the mud for sure. At least it looks like mud and it's getting real deep. Keep it real and we will all follow. 

 

Look for better reasons why we are not following you. It's pretty stupid to say we are for keeping marijuana illegal when you know better than that. You are just getting butt ugly now. 

[t-pain]

you are saying we should do decrim, and i agree.

 

why not do legalization in the interim?

[Restorium2]

you are saying we should do decrim, and i agree.

 

why not do legalization in the interim?

Because it makes it harder to wean the state off the money they are stealing from us. Once they get a taste of that they will always want it.

 

It's a little bit disheartening (putting it nicely) when you try to separate legalization from decriminalization. When you separated the two you went down the wrong path. Put them back together and leave it like that or quit using the term legalization terribly wrongly.  You are sounding like a crooked used car salesman. 

Edited October 31, 2015 by Restorium2

[t-pain]

then i'll use whatever term you want me to call it. what do you want me to call it? i dont particularly like legalization term either.

 

Because it makes it harder to wean the state off the money they are stealing from us. Once they get a taste of that they will always want it.

please actually answer the question though.

[t-pain]

i'm going to support the legalization laws , as shown in colorado that the quasi-legalization law has cut 37,000 arrests for marijuana each year.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/03/26/after-legalization-colorado-pot-arrests-plunge/

 

The total number of marijuana court cases fell from 39,027 in 2011 to 2,036 cases in 2014.

 

 

thats better than what we have now, so i'll support it.

 

whats interesting is people who support quasi-legalization have facts and statistics, while the people who do not support quasi-legalization only have fear uncertainty and doubt. zap, get some statistics or else you are a doubter!

 

i get it, you are worried about what may happen in the future.

but i know 20,000 arrests for marijuana possession in michigan ARE HAPPENING RIGHT NOW EACH YEAR AND I WANT TO STOP IT. or at least cut it down by 90%...

[t-pain]

we can at least agree about the shrinkage in arrests in the legalized states, right ?

[t-pain]

As an intellectual exercise, if the overall number of arrests is reduced, even radically, but those prosecuted are left with no defense and are sure to be convicted of felonies, would you support it? I would not.

people today are prosecuted and are left with no defense TODAY.

 

are you supporting whats going on TODAY?

 

by not supporting a law that will defend and protect the vast majority of small time possession arrests?

 

we agree , milegalize (and mmma) and other states should have removed the CSA / PHC . but thats not what we have on the table today. all we have today is the ballot proposals in front of us.

 

and timmah's abrogate cannabis draft...

 

the difference is i'll support just about every one of them if it means less arrests.

[t-pain]

man i posted the statistics of each state increasing arrests after medical in the other thread. no one even reads my bunny muffin :\

[t-pain]

oh ok...

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2015/03/26/after-legalization-colorado-pot-arrests-plunge/

 

The total number of marijuana court cases fell from 39,027 in 2011 to 2,036 cases in 2014.

 

so we look at the chart from the other thread

and it says the lowest number of arrests in colorado in one year was 3,206 in 1990.

 

2,036 in 2014 is less than 3,206 in 1990.

i'll look up the rest later, gotta go

 

lowest number in the washington chart is above 3,000 arrests in 1990/1991

 

2009 – 7964

2010 – 6743

2011 – 6879

2012 – 5531

2013 – 120

 

https://aclu-wa.org/news/court-filings-adult-marijuana-possession-plummet

 

120 arrests in 2013 is less than 3,000+ in 1990

 

http://www.drugpolicy.org/news/2015/07/marijuana-legalization-washington-state-one-year-status-report

 

again, this is all just for possession / use .

 

 

i cant find anything for oregon. under 1 oz is decrim with a ticket in oregon pre-legalization. but that does not include people in drug free zones, or cps, or asset forfeiture or probation.

 

Also, the outcome of those arrested and convicted. It is important.

i dont even know where to find this info for any state. i dont think i've seen statistics on dismissals, asset forfeitures, probation violations, etc. thats some next level data digging...

 

do courts even report that data?

[Restorium2]

As long as a prosecutor still has those threats of imprisonment for marijuana in his bag o tricks we will be selectively discriminated against. I hate being in that position. 

[Wild Bill]

 I am asking for analysis of whether arrests are back below the total prohibition era after pseudo-legalization scheme.

 

Great question. How to the arrest statistics compare to pre 1937 arrests?

[t-pain]

all i know is that in 1937, the majority of arrests for marijuana would have been black and latino.

[t-pain]

ohio's issue 3 contains medical marijuana protections.

 

http://yeson3ohio.com/the-amendment/

[Restorium2]

I can't see ever getting real legalization after this. How could anyone ever wean a state off of us? Each State that ratifies fake legalization has went past the point of no return. I see it as our destiny now. I don't have to like it and I will always remember exactly how it happened. I will always remember exactly how we lost the chance to have real legalization. Ironically, it all started with MM. The best gift ever turned out to have a larger price tag then I ever imagined. Legalization can't be saved now so you just continue to duck and cover for the duration. Keeps the mystery of marijuana going anyway. Gangsta sells weed. If you say it's medical or totally legal, that takes all the excitement and risk out of it. So lets stimulate the market with hype and continued risk. Dams to raise prices. That's where we will be for decades at least. It is what it is. Leaves room for heroes going around the establishment to get people better cannabis they can afford. Don't put your capes away, you will need em. 

[t-pain]

keep selling dat fear resto.

 

you think that way because you , like many people over the years, thought prohibition was ending. you thought you saw the end of that rainbow.

 

WELL TOO BAD. it aint over til the fat lady starts singin, and i aint hear no fat lady.

 

in the 70s they thought they were going to end prohibition too. remember those days? jimmy carter?

 

fight fight fight and never give up.

[Restorium2]

keep selling dat fear resto.

 

you think that way because you , like many people over the years, thought prohibition was ending. you thought you saw the end of that rainbow.

 

WELL TOO BAD. it aint over til the fat lady starts singin, and i aint hear no fat lady.

 

in the 70s they thought they were going to end prohibition too. remember those days? jimmy carter?

 

fight fight fight and never give up.

Say what? I'm selling fear now? You need a reality check if you don't understand that every single thing I said was spot on. 

 

Looks to me you came here today for a fight and nobody showed up to fight you. 

[Restorium2]

keep selling dat fear resto.

 

you think that way because you , like many people over the years, thought prohibition was ending. you thought you saw the end of that rainbow.

 

WELL TOO BAD. it aint over til the fat lady starts singin, and i aint hear no fat lady.

 

in the 70s they thought they were going to end prohibition too. remember those days? jimmy carter?

 

fight fight fight and never give up.

LOL Who are you fighting T? 

[Wild Bill]

LOL Who are you fighting T? 

[imiubu]

imho, people need be afraid.

 

Open up their eyes and really see what is happening.

 

If resto is selling fear then my dear t-pain you are selling the same old propaganda.

 

How can any person who has been involved with cannabis, honestly think that more

laws are going to solve this injustice?  How can you t-pain, believe this to be true???

We know how our gov't behaves and you can still with clear conscience advocate

for pseudo legalization.  man, smdh

 

again... this is only my opinion.

[t-pain]

you know i support removing all marijuana laws , imi.

 

just that i also support this quasi-legalization too. until such time as all marijuana law removal is on the ballot. progress forwards.

 

please everyone take some time to contact robin shnieder at NPRA and explain to her how having laws prohibiting marijuana only causes dispensaries and their owners and landlords to get in trouble. if marijuana had no laws against it, it would cease to be illegal and anyone could sell it.

 

do something instead of arguing on a web forum all day...

[imiubu]

Yes t, I know deep down ultimately you do want and end to this war against cannabis.

 

To call someone out for fear mongering though is rather unfair imo when you are spreading

false hope.

 

I know that you work very hard on several fronts doing what you believe to be right in this fight.

We (you and I) just disagree on how to get to that point.

 

If all the energy that was put into this legalization ploy was instead put into a repeal petition then...

 

btw... I hope you are not implying that I do nothing in this movement other than to argue on forums.

That my brother is a false assumption.

 

I guess we will see what the Ohioans think of this crap come Tuesday hu?

[Restorium2]

you know i support removing all marijuana laws , imi.

 

just that i also support this quasi-legalization too. until such time as all marijuana law removal is on the ballot. progress forwards.

 

please everyone take some time to contact robin shnieder at NPRA and explain to her how having laws prohibiting marijuana only causes dispensaries and their owners and landlords to get in trouble. if marijuana had no laws against it, it would cease to be illegal and anyone could sell it.

 

do something instead of arguing on a web forum all day...

You notice how the only opposition you have to your fake legalization are just real cannabis activists? That's how you know you are running for the wrong end zone. But hey, run fast. Do a little dance when you get there too. Don't expect the rest of us to be there dancing with you in the wrong end zone. We will be still trying to avoid law enforcement. 

[Restorium2]

Just one more thingy on this today. I just have to emphasize the brilliance in these words from T;

 

please everyone take some time to contact robin shnieder at NPRA and explain to her how having laws prohibiting marijuana only causes dispensaries and their owners and landlords to get in trouble. if marijuana had no laws against it, it would cease to be illegal and anyone could sell it.

 

Tell an advocate for a dam that funnels everyone to their door that you don't like that. Priceless! That bold end part there is why you have the prohibitionists and the dispensary owners all cheering you on. You have prohibitionists and dispensary owners using pseudo cannabis activists to do their leg work. Just DO SOMETHING DAM IT! LOL