Strict Rules, High Prices Keep Medical Marijuana Out Of Reach For Local Family

[trichcycler]

You googled? Explains it all. You have no personal experience and just googled it. The things you speak about are very, very rare indeed. The stuff of legend really. Miami Vice. Most of the smuggling around here was small loads hidden in auto parts. This aint Miami.

you ar surely predictable resto, I'll give you that!

 

maybe read the post, the whole post, and then notice I ALSO googled to see if any existed. brush up on the comprehension skills please.

who said anything about Michigan riches anyways? I knew small time hashers too, just like you. they slung ounces too. they made little money too. But I also know those who were doing the heavy work, and thy certainly grew rich. but you don't have to read any farther if you don't wish too. pick any part of this post to discuss freely, please. in or out of context, as predicted.

[Restorium2]

you ar surely predictable resto, I'll give you that!

 

maybe read the post, the whole post, and then notice I ALSO googled to see if any existed. brush up on the comprehension skills please.

who said anything about Michigan riches anyways? I knew small time hashers too, just like you. they slung ounces too. they made little money too. But I also know those who were doing the heavy work, and thy certainly grew rich. but you don't have to read any farther if you don't wish too. pick any part of this post to discuss freely, please. in or out of context, as predicted.

Makes all the difference. I have only lived in a few states so I can't say what goes on anywhere else. I just speak from experience. No google because it's not very genuine knowledge for this discussion. 

[Restorium2]

ahh, farmers market pimping ! a fine example and you did the safe thing phaq. those are maybe the growers focusing on the money I say, those slinging illegally across a table every week? but you know what ,, I could care less how much money they make, or how much they sell their product for, or how much they sell daily. who gives a chit, except maybe those focusing on the money focusing so often. If a cg makes 5k a month legally, what do I care if I only make enough to pay my bills, work light, enjoy life in comparison. growing indoors is tough work to be consistent and successful. can be alot work, anyone who thinks it is not simply hasn't tried it yet. cannabis has a value. electricity is not free. fertilizers cost cash. some people cannot build a grow area and pay for someone who can, who cares if they do that? Some of them are capitalists, while others socialists, who cares really till one buts into the other attempting to ???

Those guys at the farmers market weren't getting rich either. Just trying to pay their power bills mostly. 

[phaquetoo]

Those guys at the farmers market weren't getting rich either. Just trying to pay their power bills mostly. 

That is the truth, they are all getting 8 bucks a grm, they get less than 200 an oz, but they sell it to their pt's for 200 an oz, but they figure if its another grower sitting next to them who dont give them 12 plant grow rights, they can sell it to them less than their own pt's and than mine (who is good to me) wants me to go sit with him?  our deal was not for me to deal his weed, it was to sign him my grow rights and get a full plant every 3 to 5 wks, not me selling weed in the open and loosing what lil I have!

 

Peace

[Restorium2]

That is the truth, they are all getting 8 bucks a grm, they get less than 200 an oz, but they sell it to their pt's for 200 an oz, but they figure if its another grower sitting next to them who dont give them 12 plant grow rights, they can sell it to them less than their own pt's and than mine (who is good to me) wants me to go sit with him?  our deal was not for me to deal his weed, it was to sign him my grow rights and get a full plant every 3 to 5 wks, not me selling weed in the open and loosing what lil I have!

 

Peace

I love it. Real experience talking .... not googled. 

[outsideinthecold]

With a couple hundred dispensaries operating across the state, someone is making $$$$ in the MI cannabis market.

 

What is the typical cost to produce an ounce of mmj?

 

In a small 12 plant basement grow?

 

Or in an 80x80 industrial sized production facility?

 

And what is the typical retail price of an ounce of at an MI dispensary?

 

In 1971 there was a weekly 1500 pound run from Tex/Mex to Lansing. I shared a house with four other VN Vets. Three of us would pool our money to buy a pound from 'Coach'. Price back then was usually $140-150/pound.

 

Coach bought between ten to as many as fifty pounds.

 

Coach bought from a connection who dealt directly with the Mexican who oversaw the operation. The connection bought about one-hundred-and-fifty pounds directly from the importers.

 

Coach made twenty bucks a pound. That was about the same margin per pound as those up the food chain including the connection, and importer. Pretty simple market. Sell more pounds, take more risk, make more money.

 

At twenty bucks-a-pound, the Mexican guy at the top was netting thirty-grand a week. The connection maybe a couple grand a week. Coach's net was probably a couple hundred a week.

 

I worked part-time as a dishwasher and second cook at the MSU faculty club. I usually took four ounces at ten bucks each and sold four halves to the waitresses where I worked and ended up with a couple free ounces. I never made a dime but the weed was free.

 

In retrospect, we really did 'free the weed'.

 

Not to be confused with 'tax the weed'.

Edited February 29, 2016 by outsideinthecold

[Wild Bill]

There isn’t anything he and his wife Patrice wouldn’t do to help their son

 

Then why don't they just grow their own? If my child's well being was at stake I would certainly try that before I went whining to the government that the stores charge too much.

 

[trichcycler]

That is the truth, they are all getting 8 bucks a grm, they get less than 200 an oz, but they sell it to their pt's for 200 an oz, but they figure if its another grower sitting next to them who dont give them 12 plant grow rights, they can sell it to them less than their own pt's and than mine (who is good to me) wants me to go sit with him?  our deal was not for me to deal his weed, it was to sign him my grow rights and get a full plant every 3 to 5 wks, not me selling weed in the open and loosing what lil I have!

 

Peace

2015=3 patients

2016= two lovely patients to care for during this year.

2017=considering growing for myself only, no sure, depends on health.

 

They each pay me between $150 and 200 dollars per ounce to deliver to them. I've never collected more money than that. Sometimes an ounce a month, sometimes a little more delivered.

Nobody getting rich here, or focusing on money in the grassmatch garden I'd say. I retired years before medical cannabis, gimped and enjoying my freedoms from labor. I grew my own for a year before helping others. These patients give me the opportunity to culture cannabis and to sample all of the worlds bounty, one little plant at a time, but quicker than by myself.

I don't blame the patients or growers that seek out expensive cannabis to use. Great for the growers to be compensated and great for the patients who find what they desire. Over the years I learned from patients as far as cannabis went for them since 2008....you get what you pay for . The (electricity/fertilizer/substrate) cost to grow an ounce is cheap, but gasoline, fire extinguishers, generators, insurance, and time is not. I want everyone to grow their own, then grow for others like some of my patients used to.

[Norby]

Then why don't they just grow their own? If my child's well being was at stake I would certainly try that before I went whining to the government that the stores charge too much.

 

Because you have seen what the gov't will do to a family who does that.  I'm not sure if you know it's the most restrictive law in the country in which they can't grow their own, they can't even get street stock and make it themselves or they geet charges brought and get kicked out of the program and the gov't supposedly set the price.  This way everyone could profit and blame it on Cuomo. $350 for a gram of oil is pretty good.  Guess you gotta have the dems in your corner to make that kind of cash.

[Norby]

I watch the news every day. I know about Shkreli. What I said was ObamaCare had nothing to do with what Shkreli did. He could have done the same thing if ObamaCare never existed. They have nothing in common. They should not be in the same subject. 

Read the sentence before that and then the one before that.  It talks about $1200 for 2 migraine pills.  what Shkreli did was not fixed by Obamacare.  That's how they are related.  Obamacare brought more people into the pool so they could still charge that much and have more people paying into insurance so that the Pharma companies can make their fortunes.  Try and follow.  That's my FIRST HAND experience seeing a friend who has their insurance cover 2 pills a day for 5 days strait at $1200 a day and we all pay for it.  If we didn't they wouldn't charge $1200 for 2 pills. So again, wheres the bad info?

[Norby]

I didn't deny anything but your bad info that somehow Shkreli was enabled by ObamaCare.

Your reading comprehension is lacking.  I said Obamacare NEVER FIXED THE ABILITY TO OVERCHARGE FOR DRUGS.   Are you saying it did?  If you think that I'm saying he was somehow enabled show me.  I'm saying he wasn't stopped by it!

[Norby]

Just let it go Norby. You were wrong. Now is your chance to admit it. It's OK to be wrong.

Let's see if you still think this way.

 

Just what I thought. Always demanding respect but never thinking you owe it to anyone else.  Typical of you Resto.

Edited March 1, 2016 by Norby

[Norby]

Medical Marijuana There is Significant Support of Medical Marijuana in New York

• Because people are needlessly suffering
• Because science supports the efficacy and safety of medical marijuana
• Because there is overwhelming support for medical marijuana in NY
• Because healthcare providers want to recommend the best treatment available to their patients

Summary of New York’s New Medical Marijuana Law (S7923/A6357-E)

Under New York’s new medical marijuana law, a patient who has been certified by a healthcare provider to use medical marijuana will register with the New York State Department of Health and receive a patient identification card. Specially approved organizations — such as hospitals or community health centers — will dispense the medical marijuana to registered patients, under DOH supervision.

How Do Patients Qualify to Be Part of the Program?

• Must be resident of NY or is being treated in NY.
• Must be being treated in NY for the condition for which you are seeking medical marijuana.
• Must be certified by a NY physician who has registered with DOH to recommend medical marijuana (means that the doctor has completed a 2-4 hour training course and filed paperwork with the DOH).
• Must be under that doctor’s care for the condition for which you are seeking medical marijuana
• Your doctor must believe and be willing to certify that you will receive some therapeutic or palliative benefit from medical marijuana.
• Must have a “serious condition,” as defined by the law.
• Must obtain a registry identification card from the Department of Health (DOH) and carry their patient registry card at all times that they are in possession of medical marijuana.

What Medical Conditions Make a Patient Eligible for Medical Marijuana in New York?

• A serious condition is defined as: “having one of the following severe debilitating or  life-threatening  conditions: cancer,  positive status for human immunodeficiency virus or acquired immune deficiency syndrome, amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, Parkinson’s disease, multiple sclerosis, damage to the nervous tissue of the spinal  cord  with objective neurological indication or intractable spasticity, epilepsy, inflammatory bowel disease,  neuropathies, Huntington’s disease, or as added by the commissioner; and (ii) any of the following conditions where it is clinically associated with,  or  a  complication  of,  a condition under this paragraph or its treatment: cachexia or wasting syndrome; severe or chronic pain;  severe nausea; seizures; severe or persistent muscle spasms; or such conditions as are added by the commissioner.”
• Conditions that must be considered by the Commissioner for inclusion in 18 months:  Alzheimer’s, muscular dystrophy, dystonia, post-traumatic stress disorder and rheumatoid arthritis.
• Any other condition can be added by the Commissioner at any time.

What’s the Process for a Patient to Become Certified to Receive Medical Marijuana Under the Program?

• Patients apply to DOH to become a certified patient.
• The application (which DOH will develop) must include:
  • • Name
    • Date of birth
    • Doctor’s certification, which includes a statement that patient has a serious condition and is under doctor’s care for that condition
    • Dates for which the certification is valid
    • Photo
    • Name, address, Federal registration number, phone number and original signature of practitioner
• Certification expires after one year from the date the doctor signs it, or the doctor can specify an earlier termination date.
• If the patient is terminally ill (as certified by their doctor), the registration doesn’t expire until patient’s death.
• If the patient is under 21, a parent or legal guardian can make the application as the designated caregivers.
• Patients must pay $50 fee which can be reduced or waived if s/he is experiencing financial hardship.
• If the application is approved, DOH will issue the patients registry card that will include any limitations regarding forms or dosage made by the certifying doctor.

What Kind and How Much Medical Marijuana Can a Certified Patient Obtain?

• All allowable forms (e.g., extracts, tinctures, oils, edibles) of medical marijuana, including methods of consumption and strain, variety, and strength, are determined by the Commissioner and must be approved by the Commissioner before they can be sold.
  • • Smoking as a method of consumption of the only form not left to the Commissioner and specifically excluded from ‘certified medical use’ in the statute.
• No patients or caregiver can legally possess more than a 30 day supply as determined by the practitioner and consistent with any DOH regulations.
• Patients can get a refill of their medical marijuana can refill during the last 7 days of their 30 day supply.
• Medical marijuana must be kept in its original packaging.
• Medical marijuana cannot be consumed in a public place.

How Do Medical Practitioners Get Involved in Recommending Medical Marijuana to Patients?

• Only physicians are allowed to recommend medical marijuana, although the Commissioner has the option of including nurse practitioners based on patient need and access
• Recommending physicians must:
  • • Be licensed and practicing in New York
    • Be qualified to treat the serious condition
    • Have completed a 2-4 hour training course
    • Have registered with the DOH
    • Must be caring for the patients for whom they are making recommendation, meaning that they have done a full assessment of patient’s medical history and current medical condition, and believe that the patient will benefit from the use of medical marijuana.
    • Must consult the prescription drug monitoring program and review the patient’s control substances history before issuing a recommendation
• Physicians cannot issue a certification to him/herself

What are the Dosing Guidelines?

• Practitioners must consider the form and dosage and include any such recommendations in the certification
• If the practitioner has determined a specific dose or any limitations, these must be included on the patient’s certification
• For ingestible forms, a single dose cannot exceed 10 mg of THC

What Do Caregivers Need to Do to be Able to Help a Certified Patients?

• A patient can designate up to two caregivers
  • • If the patient is under 21, not allowed caregivers other than a legal guardian or parent unless a case if made to DOH that no legal guardian or parent is available
• No one can be a caregiver to more than 5 certified patients at one time.
• Caregivers must register with DOH to obtain a registry identification card.
• Caregivers can legal possess up to 30 day supply if registered with DOH (has to be right form and dose for the specified patient))
• Any changes or terminations of caregivers must be conveyed to DOH immediately; card will be suspended

When will the Program Be Up and Running?

• DOH must begin issuing patient ID cards “as soon as practicable”
• Patient registry ID cards and registered organization licenses shall be issued or become effective no later than 18 months from the effective date of the law or until such time that Commissioner and Superintendent of Police certify that the program can be implemented in accordance with public health and safety interests, whichever comes later.
• Governor may immediately terminate all RO licenses if there is a finding that there is a risk to public health or safety.
• The law expires in seven years unless renewed by the legislature

Are Patients, Caregivers, and People in the Industry Protected from Discrimination?

• Patients, caregivers, practitioners, or employees of registered organizations  “shall not be denied any right or privilege, including but not limited to, they shall not be subject to arrest, prosecution, or penalty in any manner, or denied  any  right  or privilege,  including  but  not limited to civil penalty or disciplinary action by a business or occupational or professional licensing board  or bureau,  solely for the certified medical use or manufacture of marihuana, or for any other action or conduct in accordance with this title.”
• Patients, practitioners and employees of registered organizations are also protected under the human rights law (housing, employment, public accommodations).
• Patients, practitioners and employees of registered organizations are protected in custody and family law proceedings.
• Registry information is not subject to public disclosure laws (i.e., it must be kept confidential).

What are the Rules for People Who Want to Be Part of the Industry of Producing or Dispensing Medical Marijuana?

• Registered organizations or “RO’s” are entities that the state licenses to produce and dispense medical marijuana.
• RO’s:
  • • Can be for-profit or not-for-profit organizations
    • Must contract with an independent laboratory approved by the Commissioner of Health for product testing
    • Cannot be managed by or employ anyone, who comes in direct contact with the marijuana, who has been convicted of felony drug charge within 10 years (unless they received a certificate of relief or good conduct)
• Growing must be done indoors (which may include a greenhouse) in a secure facility
• The Commissioner will not license more than 5 RO’s, which can each operate 4 dispensaries (for a total of 20 dispensaries)
  • • Commissioner can add more RO’s if s/he determines a need
• DOH will issue regulations for RO’s, including regulation governing security and tracking

How Do I Become a Registered Organization (RO)?

• To apply to be an RO, the organizations must meet a range of criteria, including that they:
  • • Have sufficient facilities and land or a bond of $2 million
    • Can maintain good security
    • Has entered into a labor peace agreement
    • Able to comply with all state laws
• In determining who can be an RO, the Commissioner should consider the public interest – including regional access
• The fee for RO’s is to be determined by the Commissioner
• Licenses are valid for 2 years and then must be renewed
• Licenses can be immediately suspended of terminated if the RO is not adequately controlling diversion or otherwise violating the statute or regulations.

What are the Fees for Participating?

• $50 for patient or caregiver card
• $25 for lost card
• Fees for producers and dispensaries are to be determined by the Health Commissioner

What are the Requirements about Labelling, Packaging & Advertising?

• Must be sold in a secure, properly labeled package
• Safety insert and warning label is required that includes methods of administration, clarity about individual dose, risks and dangers
• RO’s must determine and provide information to DOH, patients and practitioners about the quality, safety, and clinical strength of marijuana
• Commissioner is authorized to make rules about advertising – consistent with those for prescription drugs
• Patients and caregivers must keep medical marijuana in the original packaging

How Much Will Medical Marijuana Cost?

• Commissioner determines the price of all sales
• Commissioner shall set a per dose price for each form of marijuana

How Will Medical Marijuana Be Taxed?

• Medical marijuana is taxed through an excise tax, which means that the RO pays the tax directly  to the state
• The law established a medical marijuana trust fund – 100% of revenue is to be deposited there
• Excise tax of 7% will be levied on gross receipts and  paid by the RO
  • • 22.5% goes to county were the medical marijuana was produced
    • 22.5% goes to county were the medical marijuana was dispensed
    • 5% goes to Office of Alcohol and Substance Abuse Services for prevention, counseling and treatment services
    • 5% goes to the Department Criminal Justice Services for discretionary grant program related to enforcement of the this title

[Wild Bill]

Because you have seen what the gov't will do to a family who does that.  I'm not sure if you know it's the most restrictive law in the country in which they can't grow their own, they can't even get street stock and make it themselves or they geet charges brought and get kicked out of the program and the gov't supposedly set the price.  This way everyone could profit and blame it on Cuomo. $350 for a gram of oil is pretty good.  Guess you gotta have the dems in your corner to make that kind of cash.

 

I'm quite familiar with the draconian laws back east. I used to do regular business with some folks in New Jersey back in the mid seventies. Our street rate was their wholesale rate because of the risk they took.

 

But if my child's welfare was at stake I would risk it. Discretion rules the day.

[Norby]

Ya, but now they have an excuse, you could've been in the program.  It's for thte good of your child that we are taking them away from you. You should've paid for the "legal" stuff.

And since the commisioner sets the price, they ask the gov't to lower it. 

I agree, I'd do the same.  Esp since their "syrups" have FD&C red #4 and yellow #5 and some others I can't pronounce or spell offhand.  Esp since they don't know if they are getting full flower extract or just CBD and THC nor whether it's decarbed or not and considering no Dr can "recommend" a dose over 10mg THC.......  The law is useless unless your rich or real small.