Going Topless Outdoor

[beourbud]

They won't be happy until we can only have 12 inch plants grown in a closet with a candle.

 

Free the Weed

 

Abrogate

[beourbud]

So I suppose that, since no where is it specified of what the top and sides must be constructed, I could do a light weave of hemp cord to construct the top.

Then when I go to court I can say, " Yes, my structure was enclosed on the top. The top is made out of woven hemp cord. Quite artsy-craftsy actually your Honor."

???????

I know right....rediculous

 

What about my " convertible top? My top opens, does that make it an illegal top?

 

What about repairs to the top? Can I open it or remove it for repair?

 

Considering all the possibilities, NOT including a top in the law makes sense.

 

Why would grass defend such nonsense ?

It's one thing to follow the rules, it's another thing to just make them up as you go to suit you.

Edited April 1, 2016 by beourbud

[imiubu]

Got a mouse in your pocket ?  Bugs me when people make their statements using "we" instead of "I".

Unless I am the official mouth piece to a given group of folks, it makes no good sense to use "we" instead of "I".

 

 

IMO... grassmatch is playing the devils advocate.

[phaquetoo]

Hmm,...

 

I personally would simply put chain link or some type of wire meshing over the top.

 

For $100 it is worth it.

 

Now, the absolute 100% INTENT of the written law is that it includes all sides except the base.  Rep. Cavanaugh who wrote it stated many times it specifically meant it should have a top.  It was the whole point of stating "except the base"; including the base as a side.  Then further going onto how to secure the base by attaching or affixing to t he ground.

 

Secondly, never trust the police.  Their policy 'may' follow that, but it is for police officers, not the general publics or patients guidelines about what will be considered legal in a court room at this point.  I assume many different standards may exist in different counties at this point.

 

 Does the law state it must have a top?  By inference only.

 

Why not roll out some mesh over the top?  Or many have to put some type of view obstruction over the top to keep neighbours from being able to see it from their roof.

 

Spend a few bucks and put something over it is my opinion. Safe than sorry to me.

I would rather go the extra mile, than even if it comes back bite me, I beleive I will have a great defense!

 

Thank you!

 

What is most important is having it secure from anyone easily stealing your plants. And out of sight. Which would be common sense anyway. 

I agree with you also rest!  I mean lets face it if your not in the suburbs I dont see why a top is so important!

 

What is the reasoning behind a restriction anyway? It's rediculous.

 

It's not like a top is going to slow a ripper down, lol.

 

Why is " the base" exempt, the " industry " has a long history of tunneling.

 

The argument about the neighbors looking down from the skyscraper next door doesn't apply out here in the country

 

This is the regs we get from those who do not have any practical experience in the " field"

 

It would make more sense if there was no top but you have to keep your plants below fence height. No limit on fence/ side height.

 

Lets just Abrogate already

I agree with you to,,,,Wow.....I cant beleive I agree with all 3 of you, your posts are not that far off from each other, If im going to put up a dog kennel in my yard to grow, I may as well put a top on it also, I might think about puting hinges on the top, in case I want to have the top off,  as in your opinion,  Yea I dont think most twp or city rules allow for a 10' fence.  It may only be in some places but where I live you have to get special permission to build a fence higher than 8 ft!

 

Peace

[dutchfarm]

A few years back, we had a "visit" from Straits Area Narcotics Enforcement and we were very firmly told that we have to have a top on our grow to be legal.They said if they come back again and we do not have tops on our grows, we will be arrested, we put tops on them. Our grows have 8 foot tall sidewalls, and we occaisionally have to tie the plants(trees) down to kepp them from poking out of the top of the grow. Stay legal ,stay safe!

                                                                  Farmer Brown

[dutchfarm]

imiubu,

     sorry for the "we" in my post, but this time the "we" is my wife and myself :>)

                                     Farmer Brown

[beourbud]

A few years back, we had a "visit" from Straits Area Narcotics Enforcement and we were very firmly told that we have to have a top on our grow to be legal.They said if they come back again and we do not have tops on our grows, we will be arrested, we put tops on them. Our grows have 8 foot tall sidewalls, and we occaisionally have to tie the plants(trees) down to kepp them from poking out of the top of the grow. Stay legal ,stay safe!

                                                                  Farmer Brown

Leo and courts love the grey areas.

 

We can't let them leverage them against us though.

 

Stop the Reefer Madness. ....Abrogate!

[Restorium2]

Definitions on legal outdoor growing are included in the Update, which says the plants cannot be seen by the unaided eye, the permanent structure must be enclosed on the sides and must be on land owned or rented by the actual caregiver themselves. It also defines legal transport of marijuana plants, including the provision that no one may be in the car except the patient or caregiver themselves during transport.

The Updates are created by the State Police. “This update is published by the Michigan State Police, Office of the Director, Legislative and Legal Resources Section.”

View the complete Update here:

MSP Legal Update No. 103

[Restorium2]

Sides vs top tutorial;

 

https://www.ixl.com/math/grade-7/front-side-and-top-view

[Restorium2]

 

Definitions on legal outdoor growing are included in the Update, which says the plants cannot be seen by the unaided eye, the permanent structure must be enclosed on the sides and must be on land owned or rented by the actual caregiver themselves. It also defines legal transport of marijuana plants, including the provision that no one may be in the car except the patient or caregiver themselves during transport.

The Updates are created by the State Police. “This update is published by the Michigan State Police, Office of the Director, Legislative and Legal Resources Section.”

View the complete Update here:

MSP Legal Update No. 103

 

^^^^^^^^^^^ This is just a condensed description of the real rules. The real rule on outdoor growing (see complete update) is different in a way that leans towards having to have a top by mentioning the base. It also leans away from the original wording of the law and the intent. It's what we got with a bad, overreaching legislature, bad amendments. Better put a top on it. 

[Restorium2]

Now, the absolute 100% INTENT of the written law is that it includes all sides except the base.  Rep. Cavanaugh who wrote it stated many times it specifically meant it should have a top. 

 

The original law left us some choices by not writing the original law in an overly defined and restrictive way. That was the original intent. Why didn't this fiddly focker Cavanaugh just write TOP?

[trichcycler]

I know right....rediculous

 

What about my " convertible top? My top opens, does that make it an illegal top?

 

What about repairs to the top? Can I open it or remove it for repair?

 

Considering all the possibilities, NOT including a top in the law makes sense.

 

Why would grass defend such nonsense ?

It's one thing to follow the rules, it's another thing to just make them up as you go to suit you.

well first did you notice I don't defend this nonsense one bit. there is a difference between defend and define you know. Mal defined it even more clearly than I could, citing the original author and HIS intent. I don't thing mal defends the nonsense, only states the ever obvious in this matter, to some anyways.

 

also, I don't have "people" so get over it please. there is no group, no nefarious reasons for posting here, no sales, and no political aspirations, no websites, no constituents, no "we", no plots for your paranoia, sorry pal.

[trichcycler]

Got a mouse in your pocket ?  Bugs me when people make their statements using "we" instead of "I".

Unless I am the official mouth piece to a given group of folks, it makes no good sense to use "we" instead of "I".

 

 

IMO... grassmatch is playing the devils advocate.

actually simple. I do not believe it is in the best interest of new growers to test these laws. Doing so may be in the best interest to court appointed and private legal practices, but not to patients. Our rules are clear, no need to play devils advocate on this one. all sides, except bottom? this is so obvious that the top was intended as a rule, and authors like drumming up business for their favorite attorneys too maybe. it worked for them, very well so far. look at us, nobody can accept the rules as they are, so lets all advise the sick to break the rules because a cop said its ok. absurd.

 

patients come here for solid advice, not defendable options, and I respect that. telling the newly registered ill that no top is needed is malicious and shameful imo. good for courts/biz and such though!

[Restorium2]

actually simple. I do not believe it is in the best interest of new growers to test these laws. Doing so may be in the best interest to court appointed and private legal practices, but not to patients. Our rules are clear, no need to play devils advocate on this one. all sides, except bottom? this is so obvious that the top was intended as a rule, and authors like drumming up business for their favorite attorneys too maybe. it worked for them, very well so far. look at us, nobody can accept the rules as they are, so lets all advise the sick to break the rules because a cop said its ok. absurd.

 

patients come here for solid advice, not defendable options, and I respect that. telling the newly registered ill that no top is needed is malicious and shameful imo. good for courts/biz and such though!

I believe it's in everyone's best interest to use their own mind and totally understand the 'why' and not just follow blindly. I've always been the 'why' type. I bet most all people who would want to grow marijuana outdoors are the 'why' type personality. Not just blindly listen to some parrot and then 'move along'. 

[trichcycler]

some parrot

"(d) “. Marihuana plants grown outdoors are considered to be in an enclosed, locked facility if
they are not visible to the unaided eye from an adjacent property when viewed by an individual at ground level or from
a permanent structure and are grown within a stationary structure that is enclosed on all sides, except for the base, by
chain-link fencing, wooden slats, or a similar material that prevents access by the general public and that is anchored,
attached, or affixed to the ground;" LARA

[trichcycler]

oops, sorry
 
above post came from the parrots that cite the law for us.

more of the parroting here

http://www. legislature.mi.gov/(S(fysssghremwtlhvz2ma3xxjf))/documents/2011-2012/publicact/pdf/2012-PA-0512.pdf
edit

Edited April 1, 2016 by grassmatch

[Restorium2]

Restorium slinks off with his tail between his legs like a beat dog......   APRIL FOOLS >> (Dr. Bob and grasmatch)

[trichcycler]

[trichcycler]

zap, I get it, I do, its stupid.

 

I bet you would  instruct a newly registered grower to put a top on his outdoor garden because it is instructed in our rules and the safe thing to do

[Restorium2]

Side versus top tutorial, positioning of the object and the observer is important in understand that a top is different than a side;

 

https://www.ixl.com/math/grade-7/front-side-and-top-view

Edited April 1, 2016 by Restorium2

[Restorium2]

"But judge, when the law speaks of the base, it is really talking about a top...let me explain..."

As the judge thinks, if that fiddly focker Cavanaugh wanted a top then why didn't he write TOP. I'm sick and tired of this illiteracy at the legislative level.

[beourbud]

some parrot

"(d) “. Marihuana plants grown outdoors are considered to be in an enclosed, locked facility if

they are not visible to the unaided eye from an adjacent property when viewed by an individual at ground level or from

a permanent structure and are grown within a stationary structure that is enclosed on all sides, except for the base, by

chain-link fencing, wooden slats, or a similar material that prevents access by the general public and that is anchored,

attached, or affixed to the ground;" LARA

If what you are looking for is , the Highest Quality, Best Tasting , Highest Yielding, Healthy and Happy Plants , A Top does not even enter the imagination for a grower. It's counter productive.

 

The permanent structure base utilizing chain link for example is well described but who or why would you put a Top on it.

It's counterintuitive .

 

Its like raising children in a room they never leave , void of Natural Sunlight .

 

They will grow, but they won't be right.

 

We should be encouraging growing the Highest Quality Possible. And that is Organic Grown in Natural Sunlight. Just as God intended it to be.

[blackhorse]

MSP are cutting down plants that don't have a top on the outdoor grow. This happened in Wayne Co. last year. 

 

Less chance of loosing plants if you have a top (chain link, wire, etc.) over the outdoor grow.

[trichcycler]

MSP are cutting down plants that don't have a top on the outdoor grow. This happened in Wayne Co. last year. 

 

Less chance of loosing plants if you have a top (chain link, wire, etc.) over the outdoor grow.

yep.. better and cheaper legal patient outcomes are more likely with a top than without I've heard.

In good conscience I could not instruct a new grower to skip that "side" of the enclosure.

Secretly I'd love to see the op challenge it and win, but not enough to advise skipping the part the police

already warned him about....that would be cruel advise

[imiubu]

lmbo @ "that fiddly focker Cavanaugh".