Police Seized More Than 5 Pounds During A Traffic Stop

[t-pain]

anyone got more info?

 

http://www.ironmountaindailynews.com/page/content.detail/id/574345/Caspian--man-claims-marijuana-for-treatment.html?nav=5002

 

Caspian man claims marijuana for treatment

May 24, 2016

By EVAN REID, Staff Writer , Daily News

 

 

CRYSTAL FALLS - A Caspian man arrested after authorities seized more than 5 pounds of marijuana during a traffic stop will pursue a defense under Michigan's Medical Marijuana Act.

[Kingdiamond]

5 pounds what kind of defense can he claim with that much weight?

[t-pain]

5 pounds what kind of defense can he claim with that much weight?

that its not dried yet, and thus does not count as "usable" thus, the 2.5 oz limit does not apply.

 

http://komornlaw.com/komorn-law-pllc-14-pound-medical-marihuana-case-dismissed-pursuant-to-section-8-of-the-mmma/

[+Malamute]

This is the yooper. He is toast.  OOoops.

[Kingdiamond]

that its not dried yet, and thus does not count as "usable" thus, the 2.5 oz limit does not apply.

 

http://komornlaw.com/komorn-law-pllc-14-pound-medical-marihuana-case-dismissed-pursuant-to-section-8-of-the-mmma/

So does it specify that these were plants and not bagged up dried bud in the article?

 

If so yes  they might be able to bring that fact into the defense for sure.

[+Malamute]

Caspian man claims marijuana for treatment

 

CRYSTAL FALLS - A Caspian man arrested after authorities seized more than 5 pounds of marijuana during a traffic stop will pursue a defense under Michigan's Medical Marijuana Act.

Gerry Lee Thibert, 52, failed to appear for a pre-trial conference Monday in Iron County Court, where he pleaded not guilty to felony delivery/manufacture marijuana.

Defense attorney Donn Atanasoff said Thibert is bedridden in Appleton, Wis., after suffering injuries in an accidental fall.

 

Prosecuting Attorney Melissa Powell said Thibert had not received permission from the court to miss the hearing.

"If I don't have proof he's unable to travel by the end of the week, I'm going to issue a bench warrant," Judge C. Joseph Schwedler told Atanasoff.

 

A hearing was set for July 26 to review the defense raised by Atanasoff under Section 8 of the Michigan Medical Marijuana Act of 2008.

The act established criteria a caregiver providing medical marijuana or a patient using the drug must meet in order to have charges against them dismissed.

 

Thibert and his wife are both legal caregivers and each serves four patients, Atanasoff said at a hearing earlier this month.

Powell said she is waiting for the Department of Health and Human Services to respond to a search warrant, and is unsure whether Thibert is a legal caregiver.

 

The defense has until June 26 to furnish a list of witnesses, as well as a synopsis of the expected testimony of each expert witness.

The charge carries a maximum penalty of four years in prison, though Thibert could face up to six years at sentencing due to a habitual offender-second offense notice.

 

Thibert opted not to accept a plea agreement Powell kept on the table until Monday. Powell had been willing to amend the charge to an attempted felony and dismiss the habitual offender notice.

 

Thibert's arrest was the result of an investigation between the Upper Peninsula Substance Enforcement Team and the U.S. Postal Inspection Service, with assistance from the Michigan State Police Hometown Security Team and the Caspian-Gaastra Public Safety police dog.

[Kingdiamond]

US postal inspector service why are they involved in a cannabis case was he shipping  to his patients via USPS?

[+Malamute]

Sounds possible.

 

I guess we shall see eventually.

[Kingdiamond]

Or he does like many of us caregivers use a PO  box for our caregiving services for card mailings apps change forms etc.

[+Malamute]

I doubt that is the issue. ;-)

 

I will go to the court date when it comes up.  I don't get many court dates in my neck of the woods.

[trichcycler]

So does it specify that these were plants and not bagged up dried bud in the article?

 

If so yes  they might be able to bring that fact into the defense for sure.

 

 

Caspian man claims marijuana for treatment

 

CRYSTAL FALLS - A Caspian man arrested after authorities seized more than 5 pounds of marijuana during a traffic stop will pursue a defense under Michigan's Medical Marijuana Act.

Gerry Lee Thibert, 52, failed to appear for a pre-trial conference Monday in Iron County Court, where he pleaded not guilty to felony delivery/manufacture marijuana.

Defense attorney Donn Atanasoff said Thibert is bedridden in Appleton, Wis., after suffering injuries in an accidental fall.

 

Prosecuting Attorney Melissa Powell said Thibert had not received permission from the court to miss the hearing.

"If I don't have proof he's unable to travel by the end of the week, I'm going to issue a bench warrant," Judge C. Joseph Schwedler told Atanasoff.

 

A hearing was set for July 26 to review the defense raised by Atanasoff under Section 8 of the Michigan Medical Marijuana Act of 2008.

The act established criteria a caregiver providing medical marijuana or a patient using the drug must meet in order to have charges against them dismissed.

 

Thibert and his wife are both legal caregivers and each serves four patients, Atanasoff said at a hearing earlier this month.

Powell said she is waiting for the Department of Health and Human Services to respond to a search warrant, and is unsure whether Thibert is a legal caregiver.

 

The defense has until June 26 to furnish a list of witnesses, as well as a synopsis of the expected testimony of each expert witness.

The charge carries a maximum penalty of four years in prison, though Thibert could face up to six years at sentencing due to a habitual offender-second offense notice.

 

Thibert opted not to accept a plea agreement Powell kept on the table until Monday. Powell had been willing to amend the charge to an attempted felony and dismiss the habitual offender notice.

 

Thibert's arrest was the result of an investigation between the Upper Peninsula Substance Enforcement Team and the U.S. Postal Inspection Service, with assistance from the Michigan State Police Hometown Security Team and the Caspian-Gaastra Public Safety police dog.

 

plea deal offerings are mentioned but no mention of wet vs dry plants in a car.

doesnt look good. Lets hope he learns some rules  before his third offense.

[trichcycler]

"irked that you've given in to the rules and others have not"

 

 

is the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen you type.

 

On this side of the bench we legal patients and caregivers go to great lengths to remain legal and squeaky clean.  My disappointment or "irk" is with those choosing to break rules, rile up the courts, cause erroneous court opinions, and take a plea in the end, hurting each and every participant in the long run. I am surprised you dont feel the same way. If it wasnt for your job you just may.

 

5 pounds of marijuana after a coordinated investigation, did they plant the five pounds on him? or trick him into transporting it?  maybe, we'll have to see....

 

Great attorney defenses get criminals off all the time....YAY!!!!!! for them. YAY for the defense teams!! YAY for the freed criminals!!!   YAY for all those collecting money as a result!!! 

not so much YAY for society though, where I reside

[trichcycler]

You should describe why you think these cases are hurting you or anyone other than the defendant. I think your perspective here might be a little off.

 

The fact remains, whether you like it or not, the affirmative defense is part of the law meant to protect patients and caregivers from conviction and penalty even when the protections provided by the registry card cease, or are ignored, and that is what it does when properly applied. It is in no patient's or caregiver's best interest (nor "society's," in my opinion) for the "rule breakers" to be convicted of crimes (even felonies!) for the medical use of marijuana.

 

And I am sure your efforts to remain squeaky clean will benefit you, while others making different choices have no such benefit. Must they be convicted to make you happy and for your particular notion of benefit to society? Is the punishment of being subject to police, prosecutors, and the courts not enough for you?

 

Maybe if you make a mistake you don't want a defense? I remember in particular your awakening, for instance, regarding bags of dried fan leaves in the grow room (or for bunnies). If you had been searched and arrested (wrongly) for having bags of fan leaves in your trash or grow room, would you not want a defense, despite your ignorance of the rules?

 

Yes sir, I do understand. I would never deny a proper defense to anyone, I get it, I support it. I also get that your focus could be on the legal aspects of cannabis cases(I know so, and am happy about that, believe me)

OP's guy needs a defense He does not need to be in jail. I dont think anyone needs to be jailed for a cannabis offense. I'm not tossing him under the bus, but....

I might'd toss him out of the program, if that makes sense.  I dont know any details except what I read.

 

for a moment assume he was on his way to sell awesome buds to a nearby dispensary, and was being mailed gift cards for payment(what?) 

they bust him in the act(pun?). He needs a defense of course. Is it a medical marijuana defense? I dont know, thats your job .  If  a lawyer can save this guy with oUR Act then he deserves to be saved with it.

what I say is five pounds driving around with a caregiver card.......if that is a fact, readers are allowed to come to their own conclusions, mine is that this guy is breaking rules. he should pay a fine if found guilty of doing so.  So what if he can get off, it does not reflect well on our Act and participants. these cases have not helped me feel better about following rules. I dont feel safe growing all of the time. Participants drive around with a dispensary in their back seat, or five pounds of bud, excites cops, courts, lawyers, court opinions, city ordinances, all to restrict us further and put more fear and distrust in our Act, its protections and legal defenses.

 

maybe similar to other attorneys that conduct themselves in a disrespectful manner(ambulance chasers, sue sue television etc) in the industry. they have a defense for their actions, and may even be legal, but you and yours still dont appreciate their positions, even if you respect their rights. You may still defend them in court as best you can for their unscrupulous actions, but at the dinner table, or in the forums......what you say might not have anything to do with "their rights in court" but maybe more like how irked you may be at their actions....(while not bumming out about them because you choose not to act that way and make more money possibly) 

 

this is in no way meant to be disrespectful to you or the fine work your office performs. I would not hesitate to call on you and yours for my cannabis defense if need to. Especially because I know you like me so much and would likely pro bono my case......

 

peace

[t-pain]

you certainly like to dream and assume things about cases you dont know about, grass.

 

which is fun and all, but after all of the rumors and propaganda and just straight up lies that govt officials and rehab operators and prohibitionists spew on a daily basis, its nicer just to deal with facts and reality.

 

plus everyone is innocent until proven guilty. by a jury of their peers.

[trichcycler]

right on!  so we dont even know if there was cannabis involved at all right?

 

we dont have facts and reality to go on, why not lock the post until we do?

we have an open ended article to discuss, lets discuss it

 

why post until the court posts details?  its social media, not legal documenting. its opinions, not legal homework. if you mean to say the article is factual, then lets talk about driving around with five pounds of cannabis and being arrested for it after an investigation.  lawyers can worry about the defense, we should concern ourselves with the fact that doing this is stupid, unreasonable, and unsafe. thats what we need to tell patients, not.....didnt happen, everyone is lying, and we can defend these actions successfully, even if one or more of those is factual.

Edited May 25, 2016 by grassmatch

[t-pain]

which is why i called for more "info", not more speculation.

[t-pain]

we dont have facts and reality to go on, why not lock the post until we do?

we have an open ended article to discuss, lets discuss it

 

why post until the court posts details?

trying to post court cases so people can go see these cases in person.

 

like malamute says he will check it out because its in the same area as him.

 

you are free to discuss it if you want. i just prefer to wait for more info before discussing.

[t-pain]

and if you want to discuss... i've never personally weighed any marijuana, ever. i'm willing to bet a large majority of patients have not as well.

 

i've read people's posts, like phaq , who puts vaped bud on his toast. does he weigh the toast?

 

do people who make brownies for themselves, weigh the brownies?

 

people who put it in spaghetti sauce , weigh the sauce?

[trichcycler]

There we go, solid conversation!! kudos!  Just because I personally have never deemed it necessary to drive around with five pounds of cannabis even when I maintained five heavy user patients, doesnt mean this person did not. Just because he wasnt smart enough to make a few trips even doesnt mean he is guilty of some marijuana crime.  I stand corrected. For all I know this man was carrying oregano, and the crime lab will prove it soon.

 

I am sorry tpain, for participating in the social forum with assumptions and incomplete information, even to the point of developing an opinion, you'll get over it though, its the same thing worldwide.

[trichcycler]

and if you want to discuss... i've never personally weighed any marijuana, ever. i'm willing to bet a large majority of patients have not as well.

 

i've read people's posts, like phaq , who puts vaped bud on his toast. does he weigh the toast?

 

do people who make brownies for themselves, weigh the brownies?

 

people who put it in spaghetti sauce , weigh the sauce?

 

 

If you arent a caregiver that makes sense. If you didnt own a scale, but you did use cannabis, I bet you're smart enough to know that more than one giant zip is going to put you over your limit, and maybe you'll make two trips......but that is an assumption too lol

 

food, now we're talking...would the cops have called the brownies "marijuana" though?

[Highlander]

Like grass, I used to be unsympathetic with people who don't follow the Section 4 rules. But my views are changing. Section 8 was designed to allow a defense for ANY prosecution for MMJ. But the courts haven't honored that. Anyone busted for marijuana should be able to assert a section 8 defense in court. The chips will fall where they will. Time and time again we see cases where a section 8 defense is denied. This defense should be available to anyone who requests it and if a judge doesn't like it- too bad. Send it to a jury.

 

At this point I can't blame anyone who wants to push back against the establishment and seek a section 8 defense. It's the only way we can assert this protection for what it should be.

[trichcycler]

The current erroneous interpretation of the MMMA holds all patients and caregivers up as criminals with an immunity or a defense. I'd assume you don't consider yourself a criminal? Why consider the patient or caregiver with a defense to be one?

 

and the feds say we are felons, I get it. I have to subscribe to the rules that keep patients out of court, with more money in their pockets, and sans the arrest, by sticking to the rules laid out in the Act.

Of course I am considered a criminal, an outlaw by many, but I have a choice to follow the fed laws, or the state laws, and the Act. My doctor say s this will help me, and turns out it does. I will do it criminal or not. I promise I wont ever drive with more than my limit, grow more than my limit, or possess over my limit, the limit that affords me arrest protections supposedly.

 

 

its like this zap, you and and some legal workers are sitting around the bar after hours and talking about scumbag lawyers and their tactics like described above. would you be sitting there defending their rights in a pseudo court scene because the guy deserves a defense?(company man, cant keep your mind off of the defense tactics?)  Or would you be showing content for those guys working the same system you do in a disrespectful manner casting a dim light on your whole profession?  I leave work at home and understand this is your work. I'm here to talk about how to stay out of trouble not how much of it can be defended by human rights. I now that the system is rigged. I know its wrong headed. it sucks for most involved in it I learned. its a giant ATM machine. I hope it gets washed soon.

 

l

[trichcycler]

Like grass, I used to be unsympathetic with people who don't follow the Section 4 rules. But my views are changing. Section 8 was designed to allow a defense for ANY prosecution for MMJ. But the courts haven't honored that. Anyone busted for marijuana should be able to assert a section 8 defense in court. The chips will fall where they will. Time and time again we see cases where a section 8 defense is denied. This defense should be available to anyone who requests it and if a judge doesn't like it- too bad. Send it to a jury.

 

At this point I can't blame anyone who wants to push back against the establishment and seek a section 8 defense. It's the only way we can assert this protection for what it should be.

 

 

now now, I am not unsympathetic with people who dont follow section 4 rules. I dont wish for anyone to be jailed.I support the right of everyone to defend themselves against the cannabis tyranny.   If courts are not honoring the defense(if they are, post links please for comparison/discussion?) then they dont exist, except for the wealthy that can afford the expertise legal counsel and assert it. Most of us do not fall into that category. matter o fact I see the majority taking plea bargains, scrutiny ,ammo in the court fodder bag.

 

 

I cant blame anyone for pushing back also. until they "run out of money" and take a plea bargain. I dont see this as any help to the system, Act, program registrants so far, do you?    what has been the net worth of this "pushing back" so far? 

peace

[trichcycler]

Please explain how someone else taking a plea bargain in their own case effects your case, or a person without a case? I think your perspective here is more than a little off. Maybe you'd be better off if they chose not to defend themselves at all? Maybe they should just trot right off to jail, to make you feel better about your adherence to the rules?

sure.

first, as far as me saying people are criminals, my post says that "the law says". meaning the law, the leo, the people that make the rules up as they go, the one arresting patients , the ones that believe we are evil. the ones that get the last word in courts. I dont know if they are criminals or not really. Just because they were busted outside of the Act with cannabis does not give a free ride out of criminality. If you take offense to the law saying this please explain that to the law every chance you get, louder, and more effective than ever before please.

 

how does a person "pushing back" with a grey area, only to take a plea affect me.... . its not the same as breaking unjust laws, only to take a plea and admit guilt later undermines that principal . next we have rulings  and opinions that drive law enforcement to new heights. if in a "win" the case may set a precedence, but not with a plea, just another nickel and notch for those that make cash from cannabis arrests is all. We legal patients are stuck with court chaos, rogue leo, and generally bad vibes. Its one thing to assert your rights while on the hot seat, then bow out and take the punishment. I understand the value of plea bargaining, especially in a system that flourishes because of it. I also understand that value as applied to law enforcement, legal defenses, and police. plea bargaining may seem like a good thing to do to stay out of prison but it doesnt teach the court a thing, except they can get away with continuing the injustices.

perceived fear is real.  do lost defenses and court cases and plea bargains make growers and patients feel better? I dont feel better as a result. it feels like ten steps forward only to watch players move us back five.  you dont have to share, condemn, justify or understand the way I feel, thats the beauty of opinions.

 

"Maybe you'd be better off if they chose not to defend themselves at all? Maybe they should just trot right off to jail, to make you feel better about your adherence to the rules?"

 

really zap, over some opinions you'll treat members like that?  at least put a smiley at the end of such a blast aye? I dont "maybe" your stance here ever, thanks for that pal.

 

My opinions matter not. in the big picture or the little picture. I dont influence policy and leo does not care what I have to say or how I feel about anything. Readers can choose to agree, not to agree, or just to read posts here. No need to attack me personally to invalidate my opinions, if you dont agree with them so be it geesh

[Greg Rx]

 

 

And these cases don't seem to be restricting you further. It seems you have accepted whatever restrictions have been put upon you by the law (not by the case) and that you can function perfectly even under those restrictions (now that you know bags of trash fan leaves are not an exception). Why feel put out by somebody else not going to jail?

 

 

But I would like to be able to take advantage of GM vast skills and knowledge to sample his wares. Unfortunately we would be closer to 1-2grams per week than a profitable patient. I find myself blaming the dispensaries and their lawyers for section 8 case law that bleeds into section 4.