I Would Like To Punch Him In The Face !

[Highlander]

We have a fundamental difference in what we think the government should do. I personally don't want any government at all. The whole concept is totally evil as far as I'm concerned

But we're stuck with it under threat of violence, so as far as I'm concerned all the government should be responsible for is defending the borders and a court system.

Everything you mentioned would be better served by the private sector.

If the private sector can do it all better, then why isn't that happening? The free market will support lower prices and better services. Since anyone can start a bus service, why hasn't someone started a private bus service in Flint?

[+washtenaut]

You are both right.  Private companies would build a more efficient business but they wouldn't serve all of us.  That is a critical piece to government - it needs to be inclusive. 

 

Businesses periodically re-organize largely in order to cut away the dead wood, from a productivity standpoint.  They also refocus the company on businesses that are profitable and let unprofitable business units die off. 

 

Governments need to take care of their 'dead wood' and in order to remain inclusive, they continue to operate unprofitable 'businesses'.

[Wild Bill]

If the private sector can do it all better, then why isn't that happening? The free market will support lower prices and better services. Since anyone can start a bus service, why hasn't someone started a private bus service in Flint?

 

Because the market isn't free now. The government stifles new industry in order to give an advantage to their political cronies. What kind of hoops would you have to jump through and who would you need to pay off to start a bus company? It should be enough that the vehicles are safe, the drivers licensed and they have adequate insurance. But I'll bet you need to do more that that.

 

Look at the grief they give to Uber and Airbnb because they are competing with old established businesses.

 

Why don't we have solar power and affordable electric cars? The technology is there but it doesn't get the corporate welfare payments that the big power companies do so new start ups can't compete.

[Highlander]

From what I can tell, the biggest issue airbnb has is that people are using residential properties as vacation rentals in violation of zoning and other laws. I'm not sure I'd want my neighbors to rent their homes by the week and have a steady steam of vacationers come through who don't care how loud their music is, etc. because they don't have to live with the neighbors. Other issues arise such as personal safety. There are no provisions to confirm the rentals have appropriate fire safety measures among other things. This gives the bnb renter a competitive edge over conventional hotels.

 

Similar issues arise with Uber. No need for licensing or safety certification for vehicles or professional drivers licenses. It's a lot like paying someone under the table to drive a semi cross country without a CDL, log books to help prevent fatigued drivers, etc. So we end up with a potentially less safe service with no safety net.

 

In this country, we tried the "hands off" approach. We ended up with big money companies paying poverty wages to workers, including children, to work excessive hours in unhealthy and dangerous conditions. This reminds of a story about a coal company that would stage a bus outside Ellis Island with a sign that said, "free sandwich and a ride to Matthatan." The riders got their free sandwich and a ride to Matthatan, West Virginia. There was no ride offered back to New York, so the poor souls had no choice but to take a job with a coal company where they were charged for shelter and paid in company script, redeemable only at the company store. At the end of the week, they owed more than they earned. So they were stuck. Insert Tennessee Ernie Ford's "I owe my soul to the company store." That's just a song but reflects a stark reality.

 

Unregulated free markets breed evil among men. So I guess this is where you and I disagree. I believe that government, by the people and for the people, is needed to put checks on market forces. Otherwise, the 1% are essentially slave owners.

 

It turns out that humans are painfully selfish. Selfish as government officials padding their pockets and helping their cronies and selfish as rich folks offering crappy jobs to other people.

 

Left unchecked, people in power do shytty things to other humans. Insert the Stanford prison expirement.

 

Without government controls how do we fix these problems that humans inflict in each other? I don't think that our government is fixing the problem. The only answer I can see is that people rise up and fix the government. Otherwise, how do we fix it? The free market will only make it worse.

[bax]

to be fair, hotels have bedbugs and questionable cleaning practices. taxi drivers suck, and your neighbors can be pretty much as loud as they want, no matter if they are permanent or temporary neighbors. just ask all of the donkey rectum lawnmowers and leafblowers around me making constant high DB noise.

 

conflating uber ride sharing with a commercial cargo truck driver is a bit of a stretch.

i've been in multiple taxis and limos that didnt have seatbelts. i've never been in a personal car that didnt have working seatbelts.

 

appropriate fire measures? well, i assume the landlord wants to keep his house from being burned down. he wouldnt be able to rent it out if that happens. much like any other residential structure, in home sprinklers are not required. usually people have fire extinguishers however.

 

you want regulations for safety? you agree with the MML and hundreds of cities around michigan that now have ordinances prohibiting indoor medical marijuana growing? or the ordinances banning caregivers from operating in their own houses? thats all for safety. i had no idea, highlander.

 

if you want uber drivers to have logs to keep away fatigue, why not every driver must keep a log book? otherwise it seems discriminatory to have one set of rules for drivers and another set of rules for other drivers. why not just regulate uber to not allow any drivers to drive for more than X amount of hours?

 

which they are doing, and should have done from the start.

 

http://www.politico.com/states/new-york/city-hall/story/2016/02/uber-agrees-to-limit-its-drivers-working-hours-031204

 

i dont have a pickle in this fight, i dont uber, i dont airbnb.

[Highlander]

to be fair, hotels have bedbugs and questionable cleaning practices. taxi drivers suck, and your neighbors can be pretty much as loud as they want, no matter if they are permanent or temporary neighbors. just ask all of the donkey rectum lawnmowers and leafblowers around me making constant high DB noise.conflating uber ride sharing with a commercial cargo truck driver is a bit of a stretch.i've been in multiple taxis and limos that didnt have seatbelts. i've never been in a personal car that didnt have working seatbelts.appropriate fire measures? well, i assume the landlord wants to keep his house from being burned down. he wouldnt be able to rent it out if that happens. much like any other residential structure, in home sprinklers are not required. usually people have fire extinguishers however.you want regulations for safety? you agree with the MML and hundreds of cities around michigan that now have ordinances prohibiting indoor medical marijuana growing? or the ordinances banning caregivers from operating in their own houses? thats all for safety. i had no idea, highlander.if you want uber drivers to have logs to keep away fatigue, why not every driver must keep a log book? otherwise it seems discriminatory to have one set of rules for drivers and another set of rules for other drivers. why not just regulate uber to not allow any drivers to drive for more than X amount of hours?which they are doing, and should have done from the start.http://www.politico.com/states/new-york/city-hall/story/2016/02/uber-agrees-to-limit-its-drivers-working-hours-031204i dont have a pickle in this fight, i dont uber, i dont airbnb.

yup, neighbors can suck. And they can get really loud until another neighbor gets peeved and calls LEO who will enforce local noise ordinances. Sometimes, my neighbors (60-something couple) have a party and bonfire with loud music late into the night. Sometimes I do the same. But we always touch base with each other a few days beforehand and say "hey I'm gonna have friends over and a bonfire and music and fireworks and if you have a problem with that, let me know." We respect each other. We let each other's friends and family use our driveways to park. We get along just fine. But that's neighbors being neighbors. Insert people partying on a one-week rental, and respect for the neighbors is gone.

[bax]

have you any actual one-week party rental horror stories or is this more of a concern troll?

 

and whats to stop you from calling LEO to enforce the local ordinance on the one-week rental horror story that you just explained works on permanent neighbors?

Edited August 16, 2016 by bax

[Highlander]

have you any actual one-week party rental horror stories or is this more of a concern troll?and whats to stop you from calling LEO to enforce the local ordinance on the one-week rental horror story that you just explained works on permanent neighbors?

have you any actual one-week party rental horror stories or is this more of a concern troll?and whats to stop you from calling LEO to enforce the local ordinance on the one-week rental horror story that you just explained works on permanent neighbors?

I don't have a personal one-week rental horror story, mostly, probably because I live near Flint and nobody is gonna BNB here. But I have a good friend who owns a condo on Panama City beach in Florida. He made the mistake of letting college kids rent. And yes, the kids made a lot of noise and yes, people called the cops and then the kids were quiet for the night. But his neighbors posted stuff on the internet that soiled his condo as a party rental, and it took him years to recover a reasonable reputation.

 

But we are straying far afield of the topic. Vacation rentals and taxi services aren't the point. The point is that, without government regulation, the 1% ers will take any advantage they can over the poor folks. Our own history proves this. A pure, free market is a breeding ground for financial predators, and the poor and disadvantaged are their prey.