Dea Going To Put Kratom On Schedule One

[King_Rascal]

Other than online can this be procured at any local head shops or anything like that? I'm about to start opiate withdrawal in the next day or two. I would like some of this to help me get through it

[swamper]

Other than online can this be procured at any local head shops or anything like that? I'm about to start opiate withdrawal in the next day or two. I would like some of this to help me get through it

 

I understand it can be found in head shops, but it will be expensive and probably extracts and not the plain leaf. Personally I would stay away from that option.When ordering online I have not waited more than 3 days to receive my order. You are going to need at least a half kilo to get you through the withdrawals and more if you suffer from chronic pain, as an option instead of prescription narcotics. Go to the Kratom Reddit (https://www.reddit.com/r/kratom/) and you will find a list of reputable vendors including prices along with other peoples experiences. Good Luck!

 

I would also strongly suggest that anyone entertaining the thought of using Kratom also go to the Quitting Kratom Reddit (https://www.reddit.com/r/quittingkratom/) where you will find the stories of withdrawals from this plant that happen to be a lot more than the "It's like quitting coffee" B.S. If it sound to good to be true, it most likely is!

Edited February 7, 2017 by swamper

[cristinew]

WASHINGTON, D.C. – (February 2, 2017) – When the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA) asked for public comments late last year about its plan to impose what amounted to a ban on the coffee-like herb kratom, they may not have been prepared for both the volume of comments (23,116) and the overwhelming opposition to a ban (99.1 percent).  A new analysis by the American Kratom Association (AKA) and American Coalition of Free Citizens (ACFC) reviewed every one of the comments submitted to the DEA prior to the conclusion of its public comment period on December 1, 2016.   

 

The AKA/ACFC found several things that the DEA most likely was not expecting to see:

 

Overview of key groups.  Among those listing a profession, nearly half (48 percent) were veterans, law enforcement officials, health care professionals, and scientists.  (This reflected a total of 1175 out of 2416 comments with profession-related information.)  This groups came down strong in favor of kratom and against a ban 754 versus 9 … for a pro-kratom support level of 98.7 percent.

 

Veterans.  Those who served in the military were a large contingent among those mentioning their profession. The 449 self-identified veterans accounted for 448 comments, or 18 percent of the 2416 indicating a professional work/background.  Veterans supported kratom by a margin of 448 to 1, or 99.8 percent.

 

Health care professionals. The 576 self-identified medical professionals in the survey also came down strongly in support of kratom.  These current and retired doctors, nurses, and other  medical professionals supported kratom by a margin of 569 to 7, or 98.8 percent.

 

Older Americans.  On age, a total of 3811 comment filers indicate how old they are.  In this group, 806 (21 percent) were 55 or older.  Older American supported kratom by a margin of 805 to 1, or 99.9 percent.

 

Susan Ash, director, American Kratom Association and Jason Jeffers, president, American Coalition of Free Citizens said: “The face of kratom consumers is the face of America today.  Our groups partnered-up to examine all of the public comments to DEA on the kratom ban because we were curious about who was responding and what they had to say.  What we found is a kratom community of responsible consumers who look just like your family and the people who live next door. The results speak for themselves:  99 percent of those who comment, do not want the federal government to police the natural herb called kratom.”  

 

Katie Lair, research and communications director, American Coalition of Free Citizens, said: “The most curious thing about the public comments is that there were so few responses actually supporting the DEA.  Only 113 people out of 23,116 commented in support of the DEA proposal to ban kratom.   When you have so much anti-kratom propaganda circulating at the state level and misleading talk of a public health crisis, one would expect more public comments in support of what the DEA is trying to do.  To have just 113 people nationwide support the DEA is remarkable for a campaign like this to determine whether something should be banned for the entire nation. The topline finding is obvious: There is no public appetite for banning kratom and continued fierce opposition can be expected by anyone who cares to do so.”  

 

For this research, medical professional was defined as “medical doctors, registered nurses, psychiatrists, speech therapists and EMTs and trained first responders.”

 

The American Kratom Association led the charge when the DEA opened a public comment period running through December 1, 2016.  Of the more than 23,000 comments submitted before the deadline closed, the KratomComments.org Web site created by AKA was responsible for 16,379 comments – roughly 71 percent of total comments received at Regulations.gov. (The campaign Web site is now inactive.)

 

The findings released today by the two groups are consisted with data released by AKA in a November 2016 online survey of 105 emergency room (ER)/trauma health care professionals that found zero reported cases of deaths related to kratom. The new poll of America’s front-line medical professionals also uncovered precisely zero percent support among those surveyed for a DEA ban on the coffee-like herb kratom.

A major analysis by Dr. Jack Henningfield, Ph.D., vice president of Research, Health Policy, and Abuse Liability at PinneyAssociates, for the American Kratom Association found that there is "insufficient evidence" for the DEA to ban or otherwise restrict the coffee-like herb kratom under the Controlled Substances Act.  According to the comprehensive Henningfield report, kratom has little potential for abuse and dependence – as low or lower than such widely used and unscheduled substances as "nutmeg, hops, St. John's Wort, chamomile, guarana, and kola nut."  

ABOUT AKA

 

The America Kratom Association, a consumer-based non-profit organization, is here to set the record straight, giving a voice to those suffering and protecting our rights to possess and consume kratom. AKA represents tens of thousands of Americans, each of whom have a unique story to tell about the virtues of kratom and its positive effects on their lives. www.americankratom.org

 

ABOUT ACFC

American Coalition of Free Citizens (ACFC), a non-partisan organization with members in every state, was founded in 2016 after a statewide ban on the natural herb kratom took effect in Alabama. Our core mission is to defend the rights of people to access and choose safe and natural ethnobotanical/herbal alternatives to prescription drugs.  More broadly, ACFC defends the freedoms, rights and privileges granted to all Americans by the U.S. Constitution. As a result of the war on kratom initiated by both the federal government and state governments across the country, our group is committed to defending kratom and keeping it legal. The ACFC website is currently under construction set to launch in late winter 2017.  Our Facebook group page can be found online at: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1301010013260823/and our like page here: https://www.facebook.com/americfc/. 

For queries about membership, volunteering or just general information, please contact our communications department at: americfc2017@gmail.com

[cristinew]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/dea-kratom-ban-comments_us_589374f1e4b06f344e4074fa 

 

DEA Asked Public To Comment On Its Proposed Kratom Ban And 99 Percent Opposed It But the legal fate of the herb still hangs in the balance

[swamper]

Well christinew, I had to stop the Kratom because of side effects. Diminishing returns, started doing less for my pain, causing extreme fatigue, and ammonia/ cat tinkle smelling sweat. The withdrawals were 14 days of RLS and feeling very ill (flu like), 9 straight days of no sleep followed by 4 hours of sleep, then 7 more days of no sleep, then very little sleep <4 hour a night till day 30 while still feeling ill (general malaise) . What a nightmare for a plant that is said to have withdrawals like stopping coffee. My experience is my own and not indicative of other peoples experience, but while this plant does help others, people need to be aware that there is a large, and ever growing group of people who are experiencing and documenting hellacious withdrawals not unlike that of a combination of methadone and benzodiazepine withdrawals, and I speak from experience. I am not condemning the use of this plant and do not want the DEA involved at all in it's future use or regulation, people just need to be aware that if it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck, it probably... At first Kratom worked wonderfully and I thought I had found a miracle medicine for my condition, unfortunately that is not the case for me and I had to go back on opioid therapy, which means I will probably give up my MMMP card because I cannot afford to lose my pain management treatment because of concurrent use of another plant that does help me and does not have withdrawals. What a phucked up world we live in!

[bax]

sorry to hear that swamper. were you able to use mj to lessen the effects of the withdrawals ?

[bax]

so swamper, you made it september 2016 to march 2017 on kratom?

 

what was your max dose? what dose per day? i didnt read this whole thread.

 

any tips for people? any wise advice or maybe document your experience for us?

[cristinew]

Sounds like PAWS to me swamper.... How many years were you on narcotics and how much,.? 

[cristinew]

Works better for pain than narcotics.. but if you were a narcotic addict for many many years do not expect kratom to cure you in a few months..

Edited March 4, 2017 by cristinew

[cristinew]

My wife was on it for over a year tried a CBD patch pain relief was great so she stopped the kratom   zero wd. repeat zero.. The link you posted not one person mentioned PAWS   

[cristinew]

https://addictionsandrecovery.org/post-acute-withdrawal.htm 

 

Post-acute withdrawal usually lasts for 2 years. This is one of the most important things you need to remember. If you're up for the challenge you can get though this. But if you think that post-acute withdrawal will only last for a few months, then you'll get caught off guard, and when you're disappointed you're more likely to relapse. (Reference: www.AddictionsAndRecovery.org)

 

 

The Symptoms of Post-Acute Withdrawal

The most common post-acute withdrawal symptoms are:

• Mood swings
• Anxiety
• Irritability
• Tiredness
• Variable energy
• Low enthusiasm
• Variable concentration
• Disturbed sleep

[cristinew]

And if you treat yourself with this for pain please switch strains.. ..

[swamper]

And if you treat yourself with this for pain please switch strains.. ..

 

I had 4 different strains. I know what PAWS is, been dealing with chronic pain for many years and have stopped medications many times. The acute phase of Kratom withdrawal lasted 7 days with PAWS for another 20 days then back to just widespread chronic pain. PAWS is covered in the Quitting Kratom forum here: PAWS . What was the brand of CBD patch? I would try that in a heartbeat! The Kratom just is not a long term solution for me because of side effects mentioned above. The majority of people that are in the Quitting Kratom Forum were using it to get high and not for pain relief, many, many people successfully use Kratom to treat their pain and I believe if my chronic pain issues were just simply , say, my lower back, I think a low dose of Kratom would be sustainable. I mention the withdrawals, (I knew there would be withdrawals because of the effectiveness of Kratom does not come without a price), so anyone thinking they will be able to use this recreationally and get caught up in "chasing the dragon," will suffer the consequences. I quit CT instead of tapering, which would have lessened the WDs, because I had a month off to reassess my situation and I am a rip the band-aid off type of person anyway. 

 

I had to try Kratom because of the many people who are successfully using it is real! Again, the side effects are the reason I stopped and just like everything else not everyone has these said side effects, I truly wish it were not so because I do not like being treated like I am on probation for a violent crime just to receive my pain medication each and every month, it sucks azz! Also I do not like being a slave to the pharmaceutical companies but until I find something else that works or these "Health Care Professionals" take my chronic pain seriously and do something, anything, to find out what is causing all this pain, I am trapped by this system.

[swamper]

so swamper, you made it september 2016 to march 2017 on kratom?

 

what was your max dose? what dose per day? i didnt read this whole thread.

 

any tips for people? any wise advice or maybe document your experience for us?

 

Bax, please read the thread it is documented throughout. I was at 4 grams, weighed, 4 x daily when I felt had to stop, again please read through the thread so my experience is in context.

 

(edit)

P.S. Yes, of course mj helps to get through withdrawals, is not a cure but lessens the misery.

Edited March 4, 2017 by swamper

[cristinew]

.     LDN works great for pain also but with LDN you have to get rid of the opiates.. or go to an ulta low dose

Edited March 4, 2017 by cristinew

[cristinew]

.  also you can buy them online.  

 

https://www.practicalpainmanagement.com/pain/other/glial-cell-activation-neuroinflammation-how-they-cause-centralized-pain

 

Painkillers may increase pain

Most people know that painkillers can be addictive, but they don't know that taking opioids over a long period of time may in fact increase a patient's sensitivity to pain (hyperalgesia). This happens because long-term use of opiate painkillers causes a decrease in your ability to tolerate pain and an increase in sensitivity to pain. In fact, people taking opioids long term may keep having pain, or may see their pain increase, long after the original cause of pain has healed.

See Chronic Pain As a Disease: Why Does It Still Hurt?

Stopping opioid use can solve this problem—but it may not seem as if the pain is gone at first, because the discomfort of withdrawal can mimic the original pain. Dependency is not easy to deal with, but it shouldn't be an excuse to stay on the opioid medication and raise the risk for addiction. This is why physicians are encouraged to only prescribe opioids for short durations and be cautious when using them to treat chronic pain.

Since long-term use of opioid painkillers is a risky option for controlling chronic pain, patients are often advised to focus on other safe, proven methods for managing chronic pain, such as:

• Exercise to maintain motion and release endorphins
• Cognitive therapy to develop coping techniques
• Relaxation and meditation techniques to distract the brain from pain
• Manual (massage) or topical (heat or cold) therapies
• Other pain medications that are lower risk or non-habit forming

Edited March 4, 2017 by cristinew

[cristinew]

http://nationalpainreport.com/unraveling-the-mystery-of-pain-8825288.html 

 

Once turned on, the glia cells keep the nerves in pain mode.

Now the story gets even more sinister. Not only do glial cells seem to play an important role in perpetuating pain, but they also seem to play an integral part in developing tolerance to opiate pain medications, thereby blocking their effectiveness. Opiates, like morphine, bind to receptors on glial cells, but instead of causing them to quiet down, the morphine actually activates the glial cells to go into “pain mode” so that they release more and more pro-inflammatory mediators which make the pain get worse, as opposed to relieved.

[swamper]

Cloud 45 has the cbd patches in Gaylord.     LDN works great for pain also but with LDN you have to get rid of the opiates.. or go to an ulta low dose

 

Is your wife using the CBD or CBD/THC patch? Can't do the THC right now. I will talk with my PM doc about the LDN, looks interesting.

 

Wait a minute, THC topically will not affect drug test, will it?

Edited March 4, 2017 by swamper

[bax]

whats this transdermal magnesium i see in the quit kratom posts?

 

i dont see much about it being anti inflammatory or pain reliever in nih.gov. maybe i am using the wrong search terms.

[bax]

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT01968772

 

huh. most interesting.

[cristinew]

CBD only patch  you can pic one up at cloud 45 gaylord  do not get the cbd/thc, if you get drug tested..   Opiates should be discontinued for chronic pain they only make things worse.. It is hard to do It may take a couple years to do it right, My wife was on methadone  morphine  oxycodone for over 8 years took 2 years to heal from the damage they did  Still after 5 years off methadone the PAWS come around.. But now thanks to Kratom CBD  LDN the opiate hell is gone, and the pain is less than ever 

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-athletes-way/201605/unexpected-double-whammy-opioids-prolong-and-intensify-pain

[cristinew]

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT01968772

 

huh. most interesting.

Mayo is a good place to stay away from,..

[cristinew]

If you have Auto Immune  pain .. LDN does wonders.. 

[swamper]

CBD only patch  you can pic one up at cloud 45 gaylord  do not get the cbd/thc, if you get drug tested..   Opiates should be discontinued for chronic pain they only make things worse.. It is hard to do It may take a couple years to do it right, My wife was on methadone  morphine  oxycodone for over 8 years took 2 years to heal from the damage they did  Still after 5 years off methadone the PAWS come around.. But now thanks to Kratom CBD  LDN the opiate hell is gone, and the pain is less than ever 

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-athletes-way/201605/unexpected-double-whammy-opioids-prolong-and-intensify-pain

 

I actually felt pretty good 2 months after stopping methadone and 1 month after morphine. The PAWS from benzodiazepines lasted 20 months. The thing is all of my doctors refused to acknowledge the PAWS which I suffered after stopping Valium exists! I am going to give the CBD a go.

[swamper]

CBD only patch  you can pic one up at cloud 45 gaylord  do not get the cbd/thc, if you get drug tested..   Opiates should be discontinued for chronic pain they only make things worse.. It is hard to do It may take a couple years to do it right, My wife was on methadone  morphine  oxycodone for over 8 years took 2 years to heal from the damage they did  Still after 5 years off methadone the PAWS come around.. But now thanks to Kratom CBD  LDN the opiate hell is gone, and the pain is less than ever 

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-athletes-way/201605/unexpected-double-whammy-opioids-prolong-and-intensify-pain

 

I am guessing we are going to have to wait for a new generation of PM doctors to emerge with the knowledge of all the alternative medications for chronic pain. This is a good outcome from the crack-down on the over prescribing and overuse of opioid medications.