washtenaut

THC is often wrongly vilified for its psychoactivity. I think I get your point but if you think about it, a cannabis based treatment that didn’t actually require THC to be effective, would be able to be used by those that might not be able to tolerate the THC effects. Determining the minimum required compounds from a given effective strain that are necessary to produce the positive effect can allow one to eliminate the unnecessary compounds, possibly the THC, that may cause unwanted side effects.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/emilyearlenbaugh/2020/07/21/new-research-suggests-terpenes-and-cbd-work-3xs-better-for-covid-19-inflammation-than-corticosteroid/

It looks like at least someone is investigating using cannabinoids as a possible covid-19 treatment. https://www.zmescience.com/science/cannabis-terpenes-covid-19-0523/

Some further information on the immune response https://www.projectcbd.org/medicine/cannabis-cbd-covid-19 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2828614/ from the study Executive summary Cannabinoids, the active components of Cannabis sativa, and endogenous cannabinoids mediate their effects through activation of specific cannabinoid receptors known as cannabinoid receptor 1 and 2 (CB1 and CB2). The cannabinoid system has been shown both in vivo and in vitro to be involved in regulating the immune system through its immunomodulatory properties. Cannabinoids suppress inflammatory response and subsequently attenuate disease symptoms. This property of cannabinoids is mediated through multiple pathways such as induction of apoptosis in activated immune cells, suppression of cytokines and chemokines at inflammatory sites and upregulation of FoxP3+ regulatory T cells. Cannabinoids have been tested in several experimental models of autoimmune disorders such as multiple sclerosis, rheumatoid arthritis, colitis and hepatitis and have been shown to protect the host from the pathogenesis through induction of multiple anti-inflammatory pathways. Cannabinoids may also be beneficial in certain types of cancers that are triggered by chronic inflammation. In such instances, cannabinoids can either directly inhibit tumor growth or suppress inflammation and tumor angiogenesis.

I have used a couple of ounces of rubbing alcohol with some rock salt. The salt does not dissolve like it does in water and with some swishing around, acts as grit to help scrub off the gunk. Rinse it with water. If you want it to sparkle, a little vinegar rinse will help. Again, then rinse thoroughly with water to remove all residual alcohol and vinegar. It should not smell like either alcohol or vinegar when done rinsing

I have been reading a bit more about the 'cytokine storm' that seems to overwhelm the lungs in covid-19 patients. This is essentially an overreaction by our immune system to the virus. It seems that this overreaction is at the heart of the fluid build up in the lungs and so to the shortness of breath issue. I am no expert in this field, unfortunately. From what I have read, many of the potential pharma treatments try to also quiet this cytokine storm. I am just curious if there is any actual research on using cannabinoids to try to treat covid-19 patients.

Hi Resto. Hope you are staying safe. I fear it will get ugly real soon. We need a miracle though I think at this point. I could possibly have (or, hopefully had) covid-19. When I got ill in early February, it was not thought to be in this country so I just stayed home for a couple of weeks, trying to get better and to not expose friends to the 'flu'. I hear antibody type tests are on the way so someday maybe I will check to see if I had it. Actually I wasn't posting for myself but was wondering if the breathing relief I experienced with cannabinoids was noticed or utilized by anyone else. As you know this covid-19 virus sends people to the hospital when they cannot breathe well. If a BB sized drop of high THC cannabis concentrate can assist breathing and allow patients to cough more productively, it may be a helpful treatment if not a cure. Has anyone else used cannabis for this or in any other fashion to help in this covid-19 outbreak? If so, how have you found it helpful?

https://www.leafly.com/news/health/cannabis-coronavirus-covid-19-facts https://www.leafly.com/news/health/cannabis-cold-flu-experts-discuss (Posted elsewhere but thought some might be able to benefit....or share any other information on the subject. Most here are more educated on cannabis than the original audience so I don't mean to insult anyone's intelligence) I doubt cannabis can do much to fight the covid-19 pandemic. Cannabinoids seem to nudge the body's own systems to act....generally relatively slowly. This illness seems to overwhelm the respiratory system so quickly, I doubt cannabis would kill it off before it kills off a vulnerable host. However, cannabis may yet have a role in treating symptoms. I caught a respiratory bug in early February (probably from the Buffalo Sabres game on 2/4). I woke up on the 8th feeling crappy with a very heavy chest. For medical cannabis patients, most often their underlying reason for taking med cannabis does not go away just because they have now added in a cold or the flu. Same for me and when trying to smoke when I got this illness, it felt like the coughing may make my lungs turn inside out....way too irritating. (I am not a medical professional so these opinions are just based on my experiences.) To address one's underlying issues, you can still get medicinal benefits by ingesting differently, cannabis oil or edibles specifically. THC is a known bronchdilator and it can help with some types of breathing difficulties. If you read the articles above, in addition, there is some indication that cannabis suppresses immune response. If the immune response may be responsible for worsening breathing issues at some point, modulating that response may help. In other processes, endo-cannabinoids are essentially messenger molecules which tamp down 'overactive' responses. I am just speculating here to explain the following. When I was ill I had access to high THC cannabis concentrate as well as cannabis infused coconut oil and used a little of both with my morning coffee. Over the next several hours the positive impact on my chest congestion was so good, I thought I might actually be getting over the illness. I could breathe soooo much better. My cough continued but for a few hours the cough was much more productive at hoarking up lung mucus (sorry for that image). Although the illness should be gone by now, I don't yet feel 100%. I have had lingering congestion. Is that related to immune suppression of cannabis? It may be, I don't know, and that would certainly be a terrible side effect if so. Before writing this up, I wanted to repeat today the cannabis/coffee experiment mentioned above. Right now, the impact is the same, my breathing is again very much improved. If you have access to cannabis concentrates and/or cannabis infused coconut oil, buy some. If not, you may want to consider making your own. These products will allow you to get benefits from cannabis without smoking or vaping. The following link goes into detail on canning the resultant oil but that is unnecessary. The finished product can be kept for years without sealing or refrigeration. https://emilykylenutrition.com/cannabis-coconut-oil/

A bit of new information in this June 2019 update on Dr Meiri's work https://www.getthedose.com/blog/can-cannabis-cure-cancer

So Resto, some of the people using your one-size-fits-all cannabis extract to treat their cancer died? I am sorry. That is very painful. You may want to consider that a different cannabis extract, one with the exact compounds known to kill that tumor type, could have saved that patient. Just for an exercise, consider the possibility that you don't know all that there is to know about cannabinoids. Of course the oil provider wasn't to blame for these past deaths. The caregiver likely did the best they could with the knowledge available at the time. If however, Dr Meiri's database can now tell us exactly the necessary compounds to kill the cancer, and oil providers ignore that information, then they will share responsibility for subsequent deaths. The database is not there yet but building it will be a fantastic development for cannabis based medicines.

Wait.....you do know that I, Washtenaut, wrote the original post in this thread, right? I described Dr Meiri's research, using 'cannabis extract' and 'RSO' interchangeably in my post. I did not quote Dr Meiri nor did Dr Meiri write the original post. I did. I don't think in the videos that I linked that Dr Meiri ever says RSO. He refers to it as 'cannabis extract'. Point it out please if I am incorrect on that. I did not hear it. Someone would have to be a special kind of stupid to ignore new research because Washtenaut used the term RSO in describing the research.

Well, it is easy for me to see why you have not seen evidence to refute your personal extract theory. You are blind to the evidence that I just presented so likely also to the evidence others have shown you. Have you ever had a cancer patient using cannabis extracts not respond or worse, pass away? If so, perhaps your one-size-fits-all extract did not contain the proper combination of compounds to overtake the cancer. You can smugly claim that nothing would have helped the now deceased person but do you know that? There is no way you know that...to save us time. I have buried 2 people close to me in the last year that were taking cannabis extract oil to treat their cancer. In a sense I feel I have failed them but all along I knew the oil worked for some and not for others. If Meiri's research can better pinpoint the effective compounds and thus strains/extracts then I am all for it. I really hate funerals. You go on thinking you know enough Resto even if you don't. Someday you may grasp the importance of Meiri's research

Resto, if you could get past the RSO name, I think perhaps you could better grasp the significance of Meiri's research. In fact at this moment, I can only recall Meiri calling it 'cannabis extract' in the videos and not really calling it RSO, but I am not re-watching the videos again to be certain. Probably over a million people refer to it as RSO, so if Meiri does use the term it would seem reasonable, even if it is less accurate than you would personally like. Use of the term certainly does not diminish his research efforts Recall he is in Israel not the US. The standardization of strains, as least those provided by the Israeli government, are consistent. These are not simply patient reported strain names. These are the strains provided by the Israeli government, not the same strain provided by any one of hundreds of different dispensaries, as in the US. The compilation of these data bases is an ongoing effort. I didn't mean to imply it was done. The Identification of ALL compounds in a given Israeli strain and the strain consistency there are unique to Meiri's (Israeli) research. The cross referencing of the effective and ineffective strains against a given malady will one day result in the discovery of the exact component compounds that are the ones responsible for the medical result. A medicine comprised likely of only those compounds will then go to human trial. Different medicines will be developed for different cancer types - Med A for liver cancer, Med B for lung cancer, Med C for prostate cancer, etc. The goal is not to find a one size fits all medicine, like RSO, that may contain 150 non-essential compounds. The goal is to home in on the effective compounds for each illness where cannabis shows signs of effectiveness. Like the example I mentioned, if THC is not an effective component in treating liver cancer, the cannabis medicine that will be put into clinical trials eventually for liver cancer will have no THC. Over time, as the database becomes more robust, we will learn the effective compounds against each illness. We can then treat with those compounds exclusively, if they are available. In the interim, we will at least look to strains that have been identified to contain the necessary compounds.

I don't agree with the bolded statements. I didn't think GW was identifying all compounds (all cannabinoids, terpenes, and flavonoids), but only the 'major' ones. Maybe you could point me to some evidence of your assertions. I also thought GW's testing showed that different strains and thus (possibly) different cannabinoids were effective against different tumor types and ineffective against other tumor types. I think Meiri's work takes it significantly further. Pinpointing effective compounds or combinations of compounds advances the ball beyond identifying effective strains, imo.

You seem to be missing the point....by several miles. Did you watch the videos? Your reply makes me wonder. It appears to be strain specific. Meiri explains that different strains are effective on different cancer types and completely ineffective on other cancer types. He is certain that there is no 'holy grail' strain to treat all cancer - that is his point. He is analyzing the effective strains to determine which cannabinoids (either individually or in combination with other compounds) are the ones that are effective against different types of cancer. That means that in the future, we may be able to kill cancers with specific cannabinoids. Today, RSO is hit or miss because we don't know the effective compounds in the fight so we don't know if that particular RSO will be effective. Also, today, cancer patients using cannabis oil often struggle to tolerate huge doses of THC. The effective compounds against the cancer may in many cases not require THC at all. Those patients would be able to better tolerate their medicine if the THC could be taken out. Not at all sure what you mean about 'done already with Sativex' either.